Hmm, who wants a pie? Ok, well how about "outdated" roles?

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9/18/2008 7:28:27 PM	Hmm, who wants a pie? Ok, well how about "outdated" roles?
postalbob Everett, WA age: 23	I'm exhausted. This is one of those moments where I thought about it, and really I just want to have a woman to come home to that I can focus on the areas of life that mean something outside of work, after I return from having kicked a** at another section of life . Success is so much more meaningful when you can come home and share it with someone, life means so much more when you make sure you focus on things as a team that has different strengths. I find it odd that we've come into this forgetting roles of old and their concepts, they existed for good reason. A woman should be the guy's support, and the family support, she's a certain type of backbone in the family. She should also think about how to keep everyone happy including herself, maybe plan things to do. If you have one person at home (if possible) it just makes a solid support system for the whole family and allows a woman to focus entirely on making a dream for the family. The guy should support the family in other ways, including providing for and supporting the woman's dreams and wants, and making the dreams a reality. It makes sense...When focused on correctly, the two become planners of different sections of life for a family, rather than "making a joint decision" in everything, we should recognize and assign tasks for one or the other to handle, and decide what needs to be handled by both. What that may be will vary, but I think the whole "unified" one person thinking on all aspects is kind of doomed to failure when the two of you have different opinions. I don't know why so many people want the whole "equivocal nation" thing. I would think it encourages one to focus on ambitions and personal wants over being a fully functional, having each person fulfill a role into bettering and making sure the family is happy thing. I think the older roles worked much better, even if we reversed them I wouldn't care, but there should be a team system. Any opinions on this? -Christopher Robin Day [Edited 9/18/2008 7:58:06 PM]
9/18/2008 7:37:40 PM	Hmm, who wants a pie? Ok, well how about "outdated" roles?
postalbob Everett, WA age: 23	The old roles when done right have a higher potential. Think about it: If the woman plans on what to do, plans on how to dream, what to dream about etc she gets good at bringing out a dream. If the guy then earns it, he gets efficient at focusing on getting a dream. Now that may sound bad but think about it: How many people lose track of what they want when they focus on a career, trying to figure out what they want to do today or tomorrow, or the weekend, and then end up doing nothing? If we had one person focusing on that, and one entirely on the career, then it would be more successful. Focused endeavors are always more successful. Focused teams are always more successful. With a divorce ratio at 50% and climbing, we already know the old roles worked better, unless the guy was a d*ck. Over 10,000 years of a successful system changing in 50 doesn't make a whole lot of sense. I think people have started going backwards. We need to stop trying to make both sexes the same, and start having them be a team. I don't care if the roles reverse, but the whole insisting on us being and acting same thing is putting us backwards. Furthermore: I think it gets just as old with working. No sex is special here. If we pony up, there's less room for argument continually from "I'm not doing that you do it" and less room for selfishness. Quote from sammysammy1: The old roles didn't work, women weren't happy. So women changed them.... no going back. I gues after centuries of womens roles, they just decided they wanted to be like men and have the opportunities and freedoms they do, so they did. Is it a bad thing? Maybe... but it also varies according to the people involved as it can be a wonderful thing to have 2 incomes and 2 paychecks, a big house. People make choices... they can be in a new type role or an old one but the thing about he old roles is: woman get tired of them and being in an old role. So if you get with a woman, she could change up what she wants her role to be. [Edited 9/18/2008 7:42:46 PM]
9/18/2008 7:42:22 PM	Hmm, who wants a pie? Ok, well how about "outdated" roles?
usakindatheart Overton, TX age: 48 online now!	you just described me to a "T"... but you see... you are in your 20's... and already working hard it seems... problem I when you hit in your middle 30's... and your women has spread a little from age and babies. you are not going to want her as much... or maybe not any more but say... for argument sake... you worked through that time and stayed... all went back to normal... problem II you are in middle 40's up to 55... second time... you go through your male "change", loss of testosterone... depression... age skin changes... wifey you married looks old.. maybe had a late in life kid , still at home... you have an affair... you dump wife of 20 or 30 years of marriage... problem you worked your whole life to continue to build your career and able to take care of home and heart. children and wife... wife did home, but did NOTHING to make her of ANY VALUE FOR TODAY'S WORK FORCE. you dump her, and she works for walmart now... for min wage... your kids will hate you for it, but smile in your face for college money, and you... you do not care... money will buy the kids, and you got some young arm candy that loves your money too... and will SAY ANYTHING AND DO ANYTHING for you to get it. sorry your beavers cleavers 1950's... life style does not work in this day and age. and you better PRAY, that your women has a college education and some kind of career going, cause you just might one day find out you have cancer... and all the money in the world is not going to save you, or pay your bills or your kid or kids college... but she could help cause your women is working too... unlike most men who jump ship when things get monotonous or go south, cause of stresses in life, what ever they maybe... most women STILL stick by their man... but i have to say... like men... women are changing too.... fast.
9/18/2008 7:48:22 PM	Hmm, who wants a pie? Ok, well how about "outdated" roles?
postalbob Everett, WA age: 23	The problem is we all believe we are special from new times. People haven't changed fundamentally, we aren't changing fast, we aren't special from people a hundred years ago, we aren't special in comparison to them. Women can work or do whatever, I think you missed my point. First: Testosterone has nothing to do with anything, nor whether or not I find the girl attractive. If I had a girl that was supportive, I wouldn't care what she looked like. My youth has nothing to do with this, nor does age, nor does deteriorations of typical relationships. Second: You have somewhat of a valid point with the sick thing, but not with the wallmart job issue. I never said the woman shouldn't get an education, or perhaps a job. I did say her main focus should be on dreams, not money. If a relationship fails because people have demoralized relationships, the fault is not the roles. The fault is the people that demoralized the relationships. In a divorce the girl gets half of everything, that would be more than enough to support her, and she could get a job if she so chose. If the guy died, provided he had a life insurance plan the woman would be fine. Third: I'm talking about a real marriage, where it lasts. When that is the case? This 1950's method is the best method by far. Fourth: It doesn't matter who does what, even if the roles are reversed. Fifth: If there were money issues, why not, I don't care if both work. I said IF POSSIBLE, then this is the ideal way to go, and it is. If you can fill the roles in both ways, it should be done in a focused way. SOOOO, Rather than trying to be a feminist, please read what I say. Main concept? If you have one person focus on planning and dreaming, and one on getting and doing, you have a better end result of getting the dreams and planning, and getting and doing the things you want to, at the same time of making sure that everyone in the family has the support and attention they need. Quote from usakindatheart: you just described me to a "T"... but you see... you are in your 20's... and already working hard it seems... problem I when you hit in your middle 30's... and your women has spread a little from age and babies. you are not going to want her as much... or maybe not any more but say... for argument sake... you worked through that time and stayed... all went back to normal... problem II you are in middle 40's up to 55... second time... you go through your male "change", loss of testosterone... depression... age skin changes... wifey you married looks old.. maybe had a late in life kid , still at home... you have an affair... you dump wife of 20 or 30 years of marriage... problem you worked your whole life to continue to build your career and able to take care of home and heart. children and wife... wife did home, but did NOTHING to make her of ANY VALUE FOR TODAY'S WORK FORCE. you dump her, and she works for walmart now... for min wage... your kids will hate you for it, but smile in your face for college money, and you... you do not care... money will buy the kids, and you got some young arm candy that loves your money too... and will SAY ANYTHING AND DO ANYTHING for you to get it. sorry your beavers cleavers 1950's... life style does not work in this day and age. and you better PRAY, that your women has a college education and some kind of career going, cause you just might one day find out you have cancer... and all the money in the world is not going to save you, or pay your bills or your kid or kids college... but she could help cause your women is working too... unlike most men who jump ship when things get monotonous or go south, cause of stresses in life, what ever they maybe... most women STILL stick by their man... but i have to say... like men... women are changing too.... fast. [Edited 9/18/2008 7:59:02 PM]
9/18/2008 8:11:16 PM	Hmm, who wants a pie? Ok, well how about "outdated" roles?
usakindatheart Overton, TX age: 48 online now!	never mind... it went over your head.... you are in your 20's the best idealist age there is... talk to me when your 45... wait... never mind... i most likely will be dead then... good luck on your life young man. usa. p.s. go to your county judge, have a real heart to heart with him, set up the appointment, give him your views... he will tell you the divorce rate for 40 and 50 year old people is the fastest rate of divorce increase... and most of these women DID STAY HOME AND DID THE DREAMS>>> it just went to pot, when the man hit his middle years... [Edited 9/18/2008 8:38:13 PM]
9/18/2008 8:14:17 PM	Hmm, who wants a pie? Ok, well how about "outdated" roles?
sundayknot Compton, CA age: 39	Grow some balls man!!! [Edited 9/18/2008 8:14:39 PM]
9/18/2008 8:18:43 PM	Hmm, who wants a pie? Ok, well how about "outdated" roles?
postalbob Everett, WA age: 23	... Yes I think it did. I re-read what I posted and it occurred to me I think things internally I don't say out loud, so actually you were almost entirely right in your post, I completely did say something I didn't want to. I fixed the aspect of I think it could go either way. But when you think about it, is it really going to affect things in a positive way if everyone just did their own thing and didn't set things up to be handled in a way similar to what I said above? I am 20 ish, but actually this isn't an idealist belief... It's actually a traditional belief... So I'm already the 45 year old man telling the youngin's to get it together. Quote from usakindatheart: never mind... it went over your head.... you are in your 20's the best idealist age there is... talk to me when your 45... wait... never mind... i most likely will be dead then... good luck on your life young man. usa. [Edited 9/18/2008 8:19:26 PM]
9/18/2008 8:25:54 PM	Hmm, who wants a pie? Ok, well how about "outdated" roles?
postalbob Everett, WA age: 23	Pause to ask the following question: Are they happier now? No. What they weren't happy with is they couldn't choose (which sucked). Give them the choice for all I care, I'll take one they can take the other. However, if they choose one they can't complain on the other. Touche eh? If one person is at home dealing with the kids, and dealing with dreams etc, that would help them focus on getting plans for the kids and the family, it would for certain benefit everyone more. If they managed their own wants, everyone else's, supporting the whole family etc... It does not work. Divorce rate is up not down. Do the math. And honestly? How many women (or men) get up in the morning and say every single day "I want to go do this!!" Even the men that get up and love their jobs, don't want to get up and leave the family, or spend time away from home. They also don't like staying at home. Sooner or later people just have to pony up and realize both options suck, and choose to do what is the best benefit for their family. That would mean one person should stay home. It's a matter of who from there. Quote from sammysammy1: In the 1950's most housewives were on valium and hooked on happy hour which lasted most all day... dont kid yourself by believeing what you see on leave it to beaver shows... woman weren't happy, so they changed things, learn to adapt to the changes. [Edited 9/18/2008 8:26:46 PM]
9/18/2008 9:32:08 PM	Hmm, who wants a pie? Ok, well how about "outdated" roles?
leftfooted West Covina, CA age: 49	thats not the solution to the divorce rate,how far back in time should we go,if you go far back enough in time you can get to a point where the divorce rate would be zero unless the man wanted it,if this were true that reverting back to traditional roles would be the answer then why is it that some married couples of today do not get divorced and whatever the reason why not change to what they are doing instead of reverting back
9/25/2008 2:05:10 AM	Hmm, who wants a pie? Ok, well how about "outdated" roles?
postalbob Everett, WA age: 23	The answer is obvious. They don't want to because of pride or an ego. That logic doesn't make sense even if I'm wrong...Just because other people aren't fixing it this way doesn't mean that's not the problem? Think of how many ways you can apply that to not work. "Well, those guys aren't choosing to get a job and go to school, that must not be a solution to drugs..." People fight, and fight in relationships. Usually it has to do with who does what, and who perceives the other sex is taking advantage of them and not doing their share. The problem behind that is that there is no way to divide everything in half, and now that we are hell bent on being "equal" or "the same" mostly everyone tries to split absolutely everything down the middle. Things get confusing, how many hours did you watch the kids? How many meals did you make them? How much laundry did you do? How many hours did you work this week? How many of those hours matched up for you being able to help the kids? Do you get the point? All of those get mixed and matched and the common factor is the same: Someone is going to believe they are getting shafted. No one can sort all that out in half between all the stuff. Then one or the other gets pissed and fights over it. It's pretty often some sort of variant that spawns from gender roles being messed up that causes divorce. The problem is that is the proximate cause, and people look at the symptoms to get in instant result. I'm not saying it doesn't happen when women go belly up on the gender role, which causes just as many problems, but there needs to be a compromise that makes roles. It's been studied, roles are needed in a child's development, especially seeing how he attaches to his parents differently, and learns from them differently. The effects of no roles in a family...Are disastrous on the child alone, before you even consider the damage to the relationship. Quote from leftfooted: thats not the solution to the divorce rate,how far back in time should we go,if you go far back enough in time you can get to a point where the divorce rate would be zero unless the man wanted it,if this were true that reverting back to traditional roles would be the answer then why is it that some married couples of today do not get divorced and whatever the reason why not change to what they are doing instead of reverting back [Edited 9/25/2008 2:08:00 AM]
9/25/2008 2:11:04 AM	Hmm, who wants a pie? Ok, well how about "outdated" roles?
nickhenderson Westby, WI age: 27	WOW. I tip my hat to the woman that can put up with you. your over thinking it all. just relax and enjoy your youth. so what if your single. your to damn young to be flying off the handle bout all of this. we all want that one woman to be there. but over thinking things is for the women. my just remember K.I.S.S. KEEP IT SIMPLE STUPID.
9/25/2008 7:09:27 PM	Hmm, who wants a pie? Ok, well how about "outdated" roles?
heybrad Battle Mountain, NV age: 47	Forget role models they are all out dated!!!!!!!! get out there and talk to women when you find the one!! who the hell cares about what everyone else thinks.Its your lifes not theirs,Stop thinking about it and do it.And never talk to any women like you did here,they will run away in a second. Get this stupid nonsense out of your head it will only screw up the rest of your life.
9/25/2008 7:20:33 PM	Hmm, who wants a pie? Ok, well how about "outdated" roles?
goddess4no1 Belleville, NJ age: 41	I just want to know why he is allowed to post 'several' times in a row....and I get a 'detected chatting' notice...... NO FAIR NO FAIR....
9/25/2008 7:28:53 PM	Hmm, who wants a pie? Ok, well how about "outdated" roles?
wileyguy Wilkes Barre, PA age: 37	your rational is good in theory to an extent however people adapted to the times.roles overlap.life throws ya curves. although we hear many good stories about 'the good old days' there are also stories of sadness,missed opportunity and regret. under the ''current system'' it works because people make it work.every situation is different.each has the opportunity to make of it what they can.if they are happy at the end of the day,thats all that matters.
9/25/2008 8:00:53 PM	Hmm, who wants a pie? Ok, well how about "outdated" roles?
beeniebaby Birmingham, AL age: 58	I understand what you are saying. Now, if you can find a woman who has the same ideas that you have, y'all should be able to make it work. You just thinking about it will not get anything done. Seems to me that you have this great idea in your head but without a woman who is interested in the same type of relationship, you can talk until you are blue in the face and accomplish nothing. No harm intended. Just stating the facts as I see them.

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