Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?

8/25/2012 10:51:40 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
pentopaper Okmulgee, OK 50, joined Nov. 2008	Why do American's think they have a damn thing to do with the election of the President of the United States. This is a perfect example of what is going wrong in this country. Though most of you will bypass the rest of this post, I am going to educate those of you who really give a crap. The President is elected by an electorate. (The Electoral College) This group of electors are appointed by s...tate legislatures, NOT ELECTED by We the People. Originally, in our Republic, We the People were represented in Congress by the House of Representatives alone. The states maintained their Sovereignty by retaining the right to appoint the Senators themselves. The Senators were appointed by the state legislatures and together with the House the electors from each state were appointed. No one group had the direct ability to elect a President because the people were represented by one group, the states by another, and the president was a product of both. But unlike today, this was a time when the words Democrat and Republican represented two entirely different styles of government. It was in a tricky progressive move, in 1913, that the 17th amendment was ratified. This allowed for the direct election of the Senators by We the People. This effectively created a pure democracy out of a democratic republic. It is also interesting to note that the Federal Reserve and the Income Tax Act were created at the same tme. The problem was not so readily appearant in 1913, but with modern media control, the manipulation of the masses is very easy to see. Today the candidate that wins is the candidate desired by the controllers of the media. Any idiot knows the power of television. Today, we are at the point that every candidate available is the same guy in different clothes. Goerge Bush Jr and Sr were just as bad as Obama when it comes to economic views. Obama is just headed over the cliff quicker. Romney will slow things down a bit, but the cliff is still approaching very fast and we have now run out of time to break. We have elected so many progressive socialists in to office by now that there is nothing else to choose from in the political arena. The minute a political hopeful mentions traditional values in their PRIVATE circles they are ostracized and rendered impotent and uneffective. They are then replaced by a wolf with big promises in the next election. We have been duped people. And it has all been over the control of this nations currency. As long as your government is in bed with the Federal Reserve you are doomed to be a slave and your posterity will be born for destitution. Get ready for it. Even though Article 1 section 10 of the constitution guarantees you a substance backed currency, your government has used the 14th amendment to undermind your rights and has forced you into the use of a fiat debt based paper promissory note as a medium of exchange called legal tender. Legal Tender does not equal Lawful Money. Well I say I AM the child of GOD. I have rights that are governed by the laws of nature and of nature's God. (see Declaration of Independance) And those laws dictate that anything built on a fraud is itself a fraud. The Federal Reserve system is a fraud and any debt presumed to be built on that fraud is itself a fraud. My Christ has paid for ALL debts, for which he teaches us all to pray. ALL debts have been paid in full for those who accept, and CLAIM, the payment. I AM in debt to no one and I beg anyone to prove otherwise. So... I call for not only an audit of the Federal Reserve, but an actual inventory of Fort Knox and the so-called Federal "Reserve." I want to see just how much substance is being used to substantiate their ability to "loan" America its buying power. It is my damn gold and I want to see it...ALL of it!!! And I want any public servant that refuses or interferes to be tried for treason. Is that not reasonable? Is that not what is guaranteed in the constitution? If I am wrong, please let me know, but if I'm right..."LIKE" this and spread it around. Hope for the best, but be prepared for the worst. I just hope you know how bad the worst could be. Peace and Prosperity. Meet singles at DateHookup.dating, we're 100% free! Join now!
8/25/2012 11:24:00 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
pentopaper Okmulgee, OK 50, joined Nov. 2008
8/25/2012 11:51:47 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
pelham12345 Bronx, NY 35, joined Dec. 2011	I have long been against the electorate college... I want it to be a full majority vote.. If you win by 1 vote, you win.. That way everyone's vote truely counts.
8/25/2012 7:00:39 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
58dpilot Springdale, AR 62, joined May. 2012	The next President will be Romney and it does matter. Would have been nice to have Ron Paul, but anyone is better than Obama. When you study it carefully and consider all imlications, the electorial college actually works quite well. Each state has two Senators. Members in the house are determined by population so some states have much more power there than others. Because legislation must pass both bodies, a necessary balance of sorts is achieved. I citing the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution it is important to remember that we are a Republic, not a democracy. A Republic guarantees the rights endowed by a creator that no man may infringe. In a democaracy no such protection is afforded. A Democracy is in essence "mob rule" where the majority can take whatever it wants and make any laws it wants without respect to anyone's individual rights. Therein lies the wisdom in both systems. The electorial college and separation of powers are good things for a Republic. They help protect your individual rights from whatever majority that would would legislate them away. There probably is no gold in Ft. Knox. I saw it in a Hollywood movie so it must be so.
8/25/2012 11:28:02 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
wasaqueen Seymour, IN 71, joined Feb. 2012	These few that are speaking the truth of what the republicans want to do and most people do not want a religion running our country. Get ready to lose when you see the power of the WOMAN.
8/26/2012 12:55:29 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
gdragn Lake Worth, FL 54, joined Jul. 2011	Quote from andy505050: I just want the economy fixed. I think the religious part of the party are wackadoodles. I think the tea party is off their rockers too. Theyre as bad as ultra left liberals in my eyes. Theres not a stones throw difference between them. Crazy and stupid is crazy and stupid. And it all belongs in the same toilet....."flush" And I do worry about women's rights. Any man who loves a woman be it his daughter, sister, wife, neice etc....should be concerned by the idiocy coming out. I mean these people actually have discussions about forcible rape, and non-forcible rape. And they actually try to figure out which a woman should be able to get an abortion for. Now I'm not for abortion. I think to use it as a form of birth control is wrong and immoral. but again....ive never had to face that decision. So I don't judge either. If my 15 year old daughter got preggo....WOuld I become a hypocrit? Maybe, I don't know what I'd do. Theyre all f**king retarded when it comes to this. These people don't give a damn about the life once theyre born. If they only cared that much about that life when it was born then I'd be able to take them more seriously. Wow, brutha, tell us how you REALLY feel! Glad that you get that the "moral majority", (quickly becoming the moribund minority), like all all the fundamentalist religious, have had their agenda used to circumvent personal freedom and advance the middle class killing agenda of the corporate rich through the gop. That's how obama got elected, nobody wanted to continue that!! Hot button (non)issues and catchphrases not only provide no substance but actually expose crazy and stupid! The very idea that returning to more rich tax cut trickle down and deregulation after it's stunningly bad performance is enough to put people off romney, can't he see that? Anyone knows that debt must be paid, and immigration and birth rate are too high to allow this! We NEED family planning and birth control, and the military ON THE BORDERS! AND PROSECUTE THOSE GODDAM LEHMAN BROS and all their ilk!! That's what gets my vote, otherwise, what's the diff?
8/26/2012 2:38:28 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
pentopaper Okmulgee, OK 50, joined Nov. 2008	democrate = pro abortion but anti death penalty,,,,im thinking they got that one backwards and the other big one,,,,all the aging hippies ran around in the day screaming "down with the man" and now support a party tha is for total government take over of everything [Edited 8/26/2012 2:40:06 PM ]
8/26/2012 10:37:11 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
wasaqueen Seymour, IN 71, joined Feb. 2012	You who vote for the republicans think that this is wacko talk but the fact is that in back rooms this stuff is part of what they want done. These people talk about small government but what they are really saying is "We want the government to do all the things we want and we want to control what other people do." A woman's body belongs to her not to christians and not to the government. Anyone backing the kind of thinking that they got the right to force someone to have a baby she does not want just to please your thinking you know what god wants!! I would like to know how these people think they know that it is god telling them something and not just their own wants? Why is your god telling you what to do got to do with other people? Maybe their god is telling them something else. So who is right and you do what you want with your body but you do not own anyone else's body.
8/27/2012 5:18:51 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
58dpilot Springdale, AR 62, joined May. 2012	Quote from andy505050: Don't get ahead of yourself chief. WE got lots of work to do to get Romney elected. I hate to point stuff out but we're far from in the clear. I don't want anyone getting complacent. Theres no shortage of stupid coming out from our side. That "legitimate rape comment just lost us the senate seat. And thankgoodness that didn't happen the week before the election. Then of course we have alot of mouthy folks at the local level shooting their mouths off. I just read an article about a state senator in tennessee saying he didn't "give a rats ass" what black people think. lol... Its going to be a tight election. And this may litterally come down to a couple of counties. The last thing we need to do is drive independents away. And I also fear if our complacency loses us this election, we'll not win another one. The demographics especially in Texas are starting to look alot like California. It texas goes....so does the party. If we win and we fix all this, we'll save the party. If not....well....then Thats all. In spite of all the comments from many people that focus on narrow talking points and media promoted "crisis" I believe most people see past it. There are only a handful of issues that are important, among them government debt, the size and scope of government itself, the economy, and jobs. Think about it: Democrats accuse Romeny/Ryan of wanting to "kill" medicare when in fact democrats cut it by 700 billion to juggle figures for Obamacare. In three years Obama could not get a budget through his own democratically controlled Senate but the House sent hundreds of them to the Senate that Reid refuses to allow debate on. The idea of taxing the rich 2% of payers presented by Obama would pay to operate the government for only two days and Democrats dare talk about jobs, the economy, debt, and deficit? When elected Obama promised to "take care of entitlements during my first term in office." Well when? It's been nearly 4 years and he hasn't even scratched it. In Iowa Obama recently claimed Ryan was holding up the Farm Bill important to Iowa farmers in the House when in fact it was sent to the Senate two weeks earlier where all House bills go to die. Then we have things like Solyndra where the government wasted a half billion taxpayer dollars. Wind is only 2% of our energy needs and still is light years from competing with other fuels and layoffs in Green Energy continue to mount. So much for creating jobs with it. The Democrats bail out GM which is currently trading at $20 a share when the "government" paid $53 for it. They hosed the taxpayers to pay the unions. At the same time GM closed dealerships resulting in the loss of 100,000 other jobs and are flirting with banckruptcy again. Small business optimism is in the toilet, even large businesses are leary of hiring or expanding business because of uncertainty regarding what this bunch of government incompetents will do next. Think about the issues. The important ones are jobs, the economy, debt, and the deficit. Obama and Biden will make it worse for sure. At least new blood and ideas brought forth by people like Romney and Ryan that understand business and entitlements brings hope for the future. Obama and Biden offer only certain disaster. I think for most reasonable and rational voters the choice is simple. Four more years of lies and incompetence with Obama and Biden, our take a gamble on Romney and Ryan? Romney and Ryan can't make it any worse so it is not much of a gamble.
8/27/2012 4:39:17 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
1shadowboxing12 Mechanicsburg, PA 37, joined Aug. 2012	No it doesnt matter. As for the Federal Reserve they have plenty of gold, just not in Ft. Knox. Back in the 90s under Clinton we had tungsten filled bars, coated with gold. We sold them to China, while they stole the real gold bars to put into there bigger project. This bigger project is the Anglo-Dutch Liberal System. Which both of these canidates work for today, as many have before them.
8/27/2012 6:12:50 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
dustinwerks Williston, FL 38, joined Apr. 2011	Which one of the candidates didn't vote for the N.D.A.A.? Whick one doesn't have anything to hide I.e. birth certificate or tax reports?
8/27/2012 7:05:16 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
shawnsr33 Dayton, OH 46, joined May. 2011	Quote from 58dpilot: The next President will be Romney and it does matter. Would have been nice to have Ron Paul, but anyone is better than Obama. When you study it carefully and consider all imlications, the electorial college actually works quite well. Each state has two Senators. Members in the house are determined by population so some states have much more power there than others. Because legislation must pass both bodies, a necessary balance of sorts is achieved. I citing the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution it is important to remember that we are a Republic, not a democracy. A Republic guarantees the rights endowed by a creator that no man may infringe. In a democaracy no such protection is afforded. A Democracy is in essence "mob rule" where the majority can take whatever it wants and make any laws it wants without respect to anyone's individual rights. Therein lies the wisdom in both systems. The electorial college and separation of powers are good things for a Republic. They help protect your individual rights from whatever majority that would would legislate them away. There probably is no gold in Ft. Knox. I saw it in a Hollywood movie so it must be so. ok ill give you Romney supporters a chance here. YOU TELL ME what will MIT do for ME and the working class if elected president? I know my taxes wil go up 2000 dollars a year at the same time he cuts his, so you american dreamers tell me, cause I know you have to be asleep to believe Romneys ass!
8/28/2012 11:44:54 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
58dpilot Springdale, AR 62, joined May. 2012	Quote from shawnsr33: ok ill give you Romney supporters a chance here. YOU TELL ME what will MIT do for ME and the working class if elected president? I know my taxes wil go up 2000 dollars a year at the same time he cuts his, so you american dreamers tell me, cause I know you have to be asleep to believe Romneys ass! What will Mr. Romney do for you? I suspect nothing. That is the point and that is good. He will expect you to do for yourself. Unlike Obama he will not subject you to having to rely on him and big government or union bosses, but he is offering you the tools to do for yourself. Why should anyhone do anything for you? Certainly nothing I can think of. American values do not lead people to depend on the benevolence of a Nanny State. They give people the freedom to enjoy the fruits of their own making. Go make some. When you learn to enjoy rewards for your own accomplishments you might actually like it. [Edited 8/28/2012 11:47:17 AM ]
8/29/2012 11:18:42 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
jrbogie1949 Ventura, CA 68, joined Mar. 2009	waaaaaaaaay too retired to give a rat's ass. i got mine.
8/29/2012 11:21:14 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
58dpilot Springdale, AR 62, joined May. 2012	Quote from jrbogie1949: waaaaaaaaay too retired to give a rat's ass. i got mine. If you're so tired, why not spare us and go take a nap someplace?
8/30/2012 10:25:01 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
jrbogie1949 Ventura, CA 68, joined Mar. 2009	REtired. not tired.
8/30/2012 11:52:11 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
jokethem Kansas City, KS 63, joined Feb. 2012	Quote from shawnsr33: ok ill give you Romney supporters a chance here. YOU TELL ME what will MIT do for ME and the working class if elected president? I know my taxes wil go up 2000 dollars a year at the same time he cuts his, so you american dreamers tell me, cause I know you have to be asleep to believe Romneys ass! He will get out of your way and off your foot so that YOU can move yourself forward rather than block your way.
8/30/2012 1:13:33 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
pentopaper Okmulgee, OK 50, joined Nov. 2008	ok,,,im doing my own informal study,,,the last 2 days MSNBC has broke into almost every speach 1/2 way through just to bash the person talking,,,rachel maddows,al sharpton the sean hannity wannabe from the other side "ed" & chris matthews are almost a old tymie lynch mob.....next week lets see if FOXnews is just as rude as MSNBC is oh god that means im gonna have to sit through harry reed barbara boxer and queen nancy speaking....just go ahead and put the bamboo under my finger nails now ...well we can get a laugh when joe biden trips over the chaulk line on his way to the podium “Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies.” ? Groucho Marx [Edited 8/30/2012 1:16:55 PM ]
8/30/2012 10:23:43 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
58dpilot Springdale, AR 62, joined May. 2012	Quote from pentopaper: ok,,,im doing my own informal study,,,the last 2 days MSNBC has broke into almost every speach 1/2 way through just to bash the person talking,,,rachel maddows,al sharpton the sean hannity wannabe from the other side "ed" & chris matthews are almost a old tymie lynch mob.....next week lets see if FOXnews is just as rude as MSNBC is oh god that means im gonna have to sit through harry reed barbara boxer and queen nancy speaking....just go ahead and put the bamboo under my finger nails now ...well we can get a laugh when joe biden trips over the chaulk line on his way to the podium “Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies.” ? Groucho Marx Al Sharpton broke out in a sweat trying to read the constitution. What fun!
9/6/2012 12:48:30 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
hahehihohu Atlanta, GA 31, joined Aug. 2012	America doesnt need a good man who have good morals nor personality..good to his family and etc We just need a good president that will actually contribute something positive and fix this country's problem
9/6/2012 1:27:23 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
hellhound56 Conway, AR 26, joined Jun. 2012	Quote from shawnsr33: ok ill give you Romney supporters a chance here. YOU TELL ME what will MIT do for ME and the working class if elected president? I know my taxes wil go up 2000 dollars a year at the same time he cuts his, so you american dreamers tell me, cause I know you have to be asleep to believe Romneys ass! Lemme guess. An Obama supporter. Want to know what 4 more years of that ahole entails? The death of this country. Go ahead let him keep fking you in the ass. I dont swing that way and will be protecting my family. Odumbf**k finally convinced us of one thing. It's time for a CHANGE
9/6/2012 4:50:08 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
pelham12345 Bronx, NY 35, joined Dec. 2011	In a twisted sort of way I sorta want Obama to win because another 4 years of incompetance and policies the majority of Americans dont want or approve of will guaruntee a liberal wont get elected again for generations... And any Democrat will have to be a TRUE moderate.. Assuming by that time the chinese will allow free elections when they take over in order to collect their money further assuming our currency is worth anything after 4 more years of Obama policy a-la-Greece
9/6/2012 5:34:20 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
samii6a6ii Bronx, NY 27, joined Jul. 2012	OBAMA
9/6/2012 6:28:35 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
khan_thought Oceanside, NY 38, joined Apr. 2012	Quote from samii6a6ii: OBAMA He should teach the people HOW to fish and NOT give them the fish!!!
9/6/2012 6:58:54 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
58dpilot Springdale, AR 62, joined May. 2012	Quote from khan_thought: He should teach the people HOW to fish and NOT give them the fish!!! But Obama doesn't know how to fish. He was not raised in America and didn't have anyone to teach him. In fact he owes all his wealth and education to government. He didn't do any of it on his own. Government gave it to him. Neither he not Michelle even got very good grades in college but were still somehow able to attend Harvard. And guess who paid fo that? Taxpayers, including poor and middle class taxpayers. That's why his head is screwed on backwards. He didn't have anyone or anything in his entire life to teach him how to be self-reliant, responsible, and understand the value of personal responsiblity and acomplishment. In short, he didn't have anyone to teach him about how to be a true American or even what it means.
9/6/2012 7:23:53 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
khan_thought Oceanside, NY 38, joined Apr. 2012	Quote from 58dpilot: But Obama doesn't know how to fish. He was not raised in America and didn't have anyone to teach him. In fact he owes all his wealth and education to government. He didn't do any of it on his own. Government gave it to him. Neither he not Michelle even got very good grades in college but were still somehow able to attend Harvard. And guess who paid fo that? Taxpayers, including poor and middle class taxpayers. That's why his head is screwed on backwards. He didn't have anyone or anything in his entire life to teach him how to be self-reliant, responsible, and understand the value of personal responsiblity and acomplishment. In short, he didn't have anyone to teach him about how to be a true American or even what it means. It's not by who u are...what is important is what u know!!! And how to lead the people. I'm not against of anybody whether black or white. Your message is very judgmental...not all whites though are clean,they may have a lighter skin but the true meaning of humanity lies within us!!!
9/6/2012 7:25:15 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
rhw044 Springfield, ME 58, joined Jun. 2012	Quote from shawnsr33: ok ill give you Obama supporters a chance here. YOU TELL ME what will that socialist do for ME and the working class if elected president? I know my taxes wil go up 2000 dollars a year at the same time he hands it out to the welfare queens, so you american dreamers tell me, cause I know you have to be asleep to believe this illegal alien's ass! Tit for tat I always say. The socialist (democrat) party gets daily mileage from twisting words around and telling half truths... Noone ever calls them on it .
9/6/2012 8:42:53 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
58dpilot Springdale, AR 62, joined May. 2012	Quote from khan_thought: It's not by who u are...what is important is what u know!!! And how to lead the people. I'm not against of anybody whether black or white. Your message is very judgmental...not all whites though are clean,they may have a lighter skin but the true meaning of humanity lies within us!!! Well yong fella, it has nothing to do with race as far as I'm concerned. It doesn't make a whit of difference to me. I served with a lot of better men than Obama from every racial group there is during my military career and also with a lot of very decent Latino's and even a few Poles, Marshallese, Laotians and Chinese in private industry since. I made no mention of race whatsoever, you assumed it...assume is a dangerous condition...it can be broken down as Ass-u-me (Makes an a** out of you and me). My grandchildren are of "mixed" race. I love and respect their father. He's educated, works hard, is responsible, a great provider, and a good husband and father. Back to Obama...what does he know? Heck, I don't know that. I do know what he demonstrates and that indicates a lllot that either he deosn't know or refuses to acknowledge. He certainly demonstrates a lack of knowledge and respect for the constitution and the enumerated powers of government, or even worse simple disregard for it. When someone is responsible to run the excecutive branch of government as an elected offical bound by the conventions of the office. Obama doesn't meet even the lowest standards for job performance in that respect. He is not a leader even though one of his most important roles is as commander in chief of the military, and he is a very poor administrator as evidneced by his job performance. But he is a pretty good activist. His activism is better served in the legislature than in the oval office. He should have stayed a Senator. The legislative branch, the Congress, makes the laws so it is a good place for activists. Presidents are constituionally bound to follow the laws established by Congress and spelled out in the Constitution, it ammendments, and various Acts of Congress. Obama does not. Therefore he is a very poor president. Nothing hard to understand about that my friend.
9/7/2012 3:20:30 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
pentopaper Okmulgee, OK 50, joined Nov. 2008	,,,the more i read the more i look & esp. the more i feel in my heart 1984 is comming to pass,,,not as in how the movie is presented but little things one at a time,,,,today they want to control your healthcare and the farce is "to control costs" tomorrow it will be "well we are paying for it so we have final say so" next will be taxing you for how you live...(hell they been doing that since the beginning..ever hear of the blue laws) but on a grander scale....then they control what you drive,,then commerce,,,, and in 75 years the progressives have gotten what they want that was started in 1913,,,total socillist government that controles the peoples every move,,,,this is just the beginning,,liberal democrats gaining trust of the poor and promising everything if you just trust em enough to let them handle things for you cause they know how to handle the evil rich replubicans,,,with trust comes control and the liberal agenda is control of the people.....im not saying the liberal you and me joe citizen,,,im saying people like george sorros,,nancy pelosi,,barbara boxer & harry reed
9/7/2012 8:27:50 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
creed610 Folcroft, PA 47, joined Nov. 2009	Quote from pelham12345: I have long been against the electorate college... I want it to be a full majority vote.. If you win by 1 vote, you win.. That way everyone's vote truely counts. The problem with a purely popular vote is the favorite son syndrome. A politician only needs to curry favor in a few large states and cities to be able to carry an election. Carry Cali/NY and the more urban cities, win every election. Screw all the small states, people living in rural areas etc. The founding fathers were not stupid.
9/7/2012 8:42:46 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
58dpilot Springdale, AR 62, joined May. 2012	My freind Jim just reminded me of the big diffference between Obama and Romney supporters. Romney supporters sign their checks on the front, Obama supporters sign theirs on the back.
9/9/2012 10:59:26 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
jrbogie1949 Ventura, CA 68, joined Mar. 2009	Quote from 58dpilot: Presidents are constituionally bound to follow the laws established by Congress and spelled out in the Constitution, it ammendments, and various Acts of Congress. Obama does not. Therefore he is a very poor president. Nothing hard to understand about that my friend. i'm no more a fan of obama than i was of bush but eight years ago when dubya was in his re-election campaign we had to endure this false claim from the left ad-nausium. they could not make their case that bush does not follow the law. can you do any better as regards obama? when i asked this eight years ago the replies were all quite vague and overly broad. not one person could come up with one specific law, statute or act that bush had not followed. so here's your chance. pick just one instance where obama has not followed a specific law, act, statute or any section in the constitution and then explain why it is that not one republican congressman/woman in the house, many of whom are lawyers, not formally called for his impeachment. i'm not asking for your opinion; what i'm asking is for you to make a legal case. can you do it?
9/9/2012 11:15:21 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
man4funnsun West Chester, OH 59, joined Jul. 2012	Obama will win, The republican party has elected a doofus just to fill the slot until 2016. And we need the electoral college to keep from having a few states decide who the winner is everytime, Do you reall want the west coast, east coast and texas being the only states that matter?
9/9/2012 11:33:44 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
jrbogie1949 Ventura, CA 68, joined Mar. 2009	Quote from man4funnsun: Obama will win, The republican party has elected a doofus just to fill the slot until 2016. And we need the electoral college to keep from having a few states decide who the winner is everytime, Do you reall want the west coast, east coast and texas being the only states that matter? i'm a fan of the electoral college but it does have it's pitfalls, not the least of which is just the opposite of what you mention here. as each legislatured decides the formula for casting it's electoral votes, the california, new york and texas legislatures could easily decide together who would be the next president, and every president thereafter, regardless of how the other 47 states voted. still, i think the founders were brilliant in writing the electoral college into article two. i just can't imagine the average american having a say in who'll be the leader of the free world.
9/10/2012 4:04:23 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
pelham12345 Bronx, NY 35, joined Dec. 2011	Quote from creed610: The problem with a purely popular vote is the favorite son syndrome. A politician only needs to curry favor in a few large states and cities to be able to carry an election. Carry Cali/NY and the more urban cities, win every election. Screw all the small states, people living in rural areas etc. The founding fathers were not stupid. Wrong, those states with large dem leaning cities like NY and cali as you mention ALREADY VOTE DEM AND ARE SOLID BLUE STATES.. But theres plenty of independants and republicans in states like NY/cali but their votes are pointless because they are outnumbered.. This is why a pure popular vote would be better. And all the 'small, rural' states already are red states, but they count for less delegates because of lowwer population.
9/10/2012 8:25:16 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
creed610 Folcroft, PA 47, joined Nov. 2009	Quote from pelham12345: Wrong, those states with large dem leaning cities like NY and cali as you mention ALREADY VOTE DEM AND ARE SOLID BLUE STATES.. But theres plenty of independants and republicans in states like NY/cali but their votes are pointless because they are outnumbered.. This is why a pure popular vote would be better. And all the 'small, rural' states already are red states, but they count for less delegates because of lowwer population. Wrong instead of political parties that try to build a consensus across the country you would get regional "favorite sons" candidates and once in power they would then push things to favor their regional bases to maintain that power. Now if you're worried about what you mentioned, then a bill like Cali is doing that rewards electoral college votes proportionally to the popular vote would make sense but a strict abolition of the electoral college would definitely start a run of regional only candidates.
9/10/2012 9:38:45 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
creed610 Folcroft, PA 47, joined Nov. 2009	Andy, some states have tried to implement this but both parties are against it. The winner takes all system works for them to help keep powerbases. I do agree with you that it would be a good system, but it could only happen with grass roots movements full of people from both sides. .
9/11/2012 9:33:41 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
58dpilot Springdale, AR 62, joined May. 2012	It is proportional. Very proportional, with some safeguards built in, too. The number of representatives a state gets to send to Washington is based on population. Each state gets the number of electors in the electorial college as it has representatives in the House of Representatives plus 2 electors for each of it's two senators. For example, Arkansas has 6 electrial votes because it has 4 representatives in the House and like every state two Senators in the Senate. As for a few examples of other states Alaska has 3, and a high population state like Calipornia has 55. Obama won't win Alaska, period but could win California. A "battleground State" is one where the outcome is not well known like Florida that has 29 and is a close call in polls. All the states together have a total of 538 electors so whoever gets at least 270 wins. If for some reason nobody gets the 270 needed to win a simple majority vote is taken in the House of Represetnatives and whoever gets the simple majority there wins. Rignt now the House has more republicans than democrats so Romney would win if it came to that. It is possible for someone to win and not win a majority of the popular vote. If someone wins 11 of the following states they will get the 270 electorial votes needed to win. Those states are: California, New York, Texas, Florida, Pennsylvania, Illinois, Ohio, Michigan, New Jersey, North Carolina, Georgia, and Virginia. By winning 11 of these and losing the other 39 states they would still win the election. In the 2000 election Bush got 50,456,002 popular votes won 271 electoral votes. Al Gore, won the popular vote with 50,999,897 votes, but won only 266 electoral votes so Bush was the winner even though he lost the popular vote. The system is not perfect, but it is as fair as system as could be designed. A quote attributed to Abe Lincoln goes, "You can fool all the people some of the time and you an fool some of the people all of the time, but you can't fool all the people all the time.". That's why the electroria college is important. Fooling enough people for enough of the time could result in electorial disater. The electorial college makes it much more difficult to do that.
9/11/2012 12:51:00 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
creed610 Folcroft, PA 47, joined Nov. 2009	Pilot, it's not proportion as it relates to the individual voting/electoral vote. Let's say a state with 20 electoral college votes goes 49/48/3 on party lines, all 20 votes go the party with 49% even though over 50% of the people in the state did not want to vote for that party. So really, in a state like PA the president doesn't need to campaign much or even give a shit about the state because he'll carry Philly and Pittsburgh so the rest of the states votes won't matter. This is part of what leads to voter apathy too.
9/11/2012 6:26:41 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
58dpilot Springdale, AR 62, joined May. 2012	All of which indicates to me the great wisdom of the founders. Unlike today, back then only property owners of means were allowed to vote at all. They knew the pitfalls of letting every miscreant that drew breath having the right to vote. They understood that when people learn that they can "prosper" by voting themselves benefits from the treasury they would and put prosperity at risk. So that's what we have now. Once only responsible people could vote, not anyone that can show up even if they are not a citizen or even who they say they are can. No wonder the system is so screwed up! Look at the politics it has given us. Look at the obaminations it has let into public office. Shoulda kept the plan the way it was designed. It worked beautifully while it was.
9/11/2012 9:48:27 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
58dpilot Springdale, AR 62, joined May. 2012	I have no idea how the republican or either party "exists" as you put it. I am niether. If anything I'm a strict constitutionalist and closer to a tea partying libertarian than anything else even though I don't swallow everything either of those groups profess, either. I also believe too many people are too inherently stupid or ignorant of basic civics and the business that is our economy to be trusted to vote. By the way, this whole idea of "working poor" and so on is a bunch of crap. Everyone can do nearly anything they want if they care to just do it. Because some choose not to that is up to them. The working poor don't create any wealth, they merely work for someone else that does. They get paid what their labor is worth, period. A brick layer makes big money while the smuck hauling the bricks to him gets paid for what he does, pure dumb labor anyone can do that isn't worth much money. The idea that "I carried the bricks that built that wall" is some great accomplishment is silly. The expertise to mix mortar, apply it, run a level and even line, and make something that will last for hundreds of years is an accomplishment. The rest is BS to make the "little fella" feel good about not doing much. I can't count the times over the last 20 years I listened to some bozo in a bar btch about illegals taking all the jobs and he couldn't find one. When I offered him one by noon the next day the answer always was, "I ain't working in no chicken plant!". Shit, it pays $10-12 an hour with benefits and paid holidays and vacations. The food industry is rife with illegals because they can get good enough papers to work there and are happy to while "our working poor" are too good for such work. If our "working poor" would do jobs available like working in chicken, turkey, seafood, and meat packing plants they can could easily earn far more than minimum wage, and enjoy fairly generous benefits. They are not willing to, if they were why are those kinds of plants staffed mostly with illegals? It is simply because "our working poor" don't want to do it. Live hangers in turkey plants can make $16 an hour. Did you know that? Did you know that 90% of the live hangers in those plants are illegal aliens making $16 an hour plus benefits? I bet not. Regardless, there are a few million jobs available in those industries that are being done by illegal aliens instead of Americans. I know. I worked in those places unitl very recently for nearly 20 years. ICE can round up a few hundred workers in any of those plants any day in spite of all the safeguards to keep illegals from working that are in place. It's a simple fact, and the government is implicit in allowing it to go on. Terms like "minimum wage" are pretty much meaningless, too. It is just a number and if someone wants to earn more than whatever that is it is up to them. The employer sets the wage and minimum wage used to be the least you could pay a part time teenager that is in school. If some adult wants to do the work of a part time teenager they need to get comfortable with what part time teenagers that are in school earn. Jobs are simple things. They consist of three elements: what you do, where you do it, and how much money you want to make. The easiest thing to do is make money. If you don't care what you have to do or where you have to go to do it it is very easy to make all you want. As soon as you start caring about the other two conditions it becomes harder to satisfy all three elements. If you want to be rich but a shoe shine boy in Paducah, Kentucy you might have trouble putting it together. If you want to be rich you need to go to college and become a school teacher in Chicago. The damned government makes it so hard for a business to do anything, erects so many barriers to everything, and absorbs so much revenue it's tough to do anything and make a profit if you are one of those big businesses. The wonderful Volt will wind up bankrupting GM again. Another government mandate gone bad, just like nearly everything else this dumb a* government does. An finally, no. Small business' are not the major job creators. If they were why didn't Obama bail them out and make life and growth easier for them? Hell no, he saved the UAW instead. It's all BS buddy boy. I stand by the theory that when you let people vote themselves bennies, they will...and they have at an astounding pace for the last 45 years. Look where it got us. Go Google voting and see the history of voting in America. Everybody wasn't allowed to vote until the 60's. Draw a timeline. Then go look up American economy and superimpose it on that timeline and see what each round of letting more people vote did for the economy, GDP, growth, industrial development, expansion, personal wealth, and poverty. It is clear that over the last 120 years people voted themselves into poverty, perhaps because it's easier than working for a living. Maybe that's why foreigners that don't have those benefits at home are so happy to exploit them here?
9/12/2012 5:44:35 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
pelham12345 Bronx, NY 35, joined Dec. 2011	Quote from andy505050: Keep the electoral college, but let states allocate the electoral votes differently. Winner take all is a very bad system. It makes states that are solid blue or solid red irrelevant. No citizen or their vote should ever be irrelevant. Why should my vote in Ohio be more important than someone elses vote in New York or Alabama? If we allocated electoral votes proportionately, presidential candidates would have to pay more attention to everyone and not just a few states. I think this would inject a little honesty into our political system. If youre a democrat its a good bet that you vote for democrats all the way down the page and vice versa with republicans. but what if you really like the president from another party? They took the time to visit your town, they listened to what you said etc....Then you start looking for other candidates that even if you disagree with them, they probably have more character than someone of your own party.....next thing you know the entire system is different. As a people we have elected people that are americans, not just republicans or democrats. WHich means we'll have a better govt that really is for the people, by the people. This is what i'm saying.. But if you are going to just break down the electorals based on votes, why not just do away with it all together then? If a state has 10 electorals and the candiate split goes 60-40, candiates get 6 and 4.. Why not just skip the extra step and tally the raw votes? Other than for simplicity on the election day map for dumb dumbs
9/12/2012 5:50:45 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
pelham12345 Bronx, NY 35, joined Dec. 2011	Pilot, cali is NOT a battleground state, it is a solid Blue state. Sure, they elect a republican or 2 to congress and a govenator here an there, but the federal elections are solidly blue and a slam dunk i-dont-even-need-to-go-there except to fundraise state for a democrat (just like NY).
9/12/2012 8:18:40 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
58dpilot Springdale, AR 62, joined May. 2012	If you divide the electorial college votes between candidates you have essentially just put things back in the hands of a simple majority. The reason the electorial college was established was to create a safeguard to avoid just that. Here is an example for you where a simple majority gets it wrong. Itis from Cali"porn"ia. Someone got a referendum on the ballot to ban killing mountain lions for any reason. After all, who would want to kill such beautiful creatures and their cute fuzzy little kittens? Well nobody unless you are a farmer and they are destroying your livestock or a hiker that is attacked. Well, the city folk that think in terms of stuff like the Lion King movies won that onw hands down. The farmers were screwed. Once of the craziest outcomes was when they became so plentiful that they started to be a hazard close to cities and communities and thier hiking trails and killed a woman jogger, the NAtural Resources people killed the cat responsible. But they found BABIES! Poor thing had two babies! City folk started a fund and collected hundreds of thousands of dollars to save the babies. The poor dead woman's children? Nada. Not a penny. City folk have no business voting on things that adversely affect farmers. They should vote on things that affect city folks. Let the farmers vote on things that affect farmers. That way no one is misrepresented by an unwitting majority. As more people move off of farms on into cities and some states become gigantic collections of city dwellers the electorial college system becomes even more important. It helps balance and protect the rights of less populous states.
9/13/2012 9:43:58 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
58dpilot Springdale, AR 62, joined May. 2012	That's the point of all politics being local. The higher up it goes through State and on to the Federal level the worse it gets and the more poorly everyone is served.
9/13/2012 10:53:29 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
lwflaboy3240 Haines City, FL 28, joined Jul. 2012	Wow penopaper u had a fan until u said that obama would put us over the cliff faster then romney even though house rep. Screwwed up all year long man get off the prezz i hope mitt becomes prez and raises your taxes which he will oklahoma boy have fun voting on a white man cuz that will b your only reason for doing so. O and hatetred for the president which is the main reason wow america the beautiful
9/13/2012 11:13:58 AM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
58dpilot Springdale, AR 62, joined May. 2012	Quote from lwflaboy3240: Wow penopaper u had a fan until u said that obama would put us over the cliff faster then romney even though house rep. Screwwed up all year long man get off the prezz i hope mitt becomes prez and raises your taxes which he will oklahoma boy have fun voting on a white man cuz that will b your only reason for doing so. O and hatetred for the president which is the main reason wow america the beautiful Come back when you are a little more mature and knowledgeable. You can't even execute the English language properly. How would one expect you to have any clear thoughts or ideas? Geez! Who is from Oklahoma? I believe OH is the abbreviation for Ohio. [Edited 9/13/2012 11:16:38 AM ]
9/13/2012 12:41:32 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
creed610 Folcroft, PA 47, joined Nov. 2009	Quote from 58dpilot: If you divide the electorial college votes between candidates you have essentially just put things back in the hands of a simple majority. The reason the electorial college was established was to create a safeguard to avoid just that. Not entirely true. Right now, especially in the blue states a Dem doesn't have to campaign there because they know the urban centers will carry the states. Heck the urban centers will vote Dem even if the Politician never doesn't anything for the state/cities just because they've been ingrained to vote dem. So for a state like PA, 20 electoral votes iirc neither Romney nor Obama will campaign much there. Romney won't because there isn't enough population in the middle of the state to outweigh Philadelphia and Pittsburgh, Obama the same reason. Now if Romney could sway 9 EC votes out of there by capturing the middle he has to pay attention to PA and so does Obama. What this does is eliminate stronghold states. NY is the same way, NYC/Buffalo/Albany will go overwhelmingly Dem in the national election but there are quite a few republicans there. Under a proportional vote system of the EC every state is important in every election while also avoiding the Favorite Son/population centers issue the Founding Fathers were worried about.
9/13/2012 12:43:36 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
creed610 Folcroft, PA 47, joined Nov. 2009	Quote from andy505050: The only time that people in urban areas should have a say in what people in rural areas are doing is if it affects them in a negative way. For example, if a farmer is dumping fertilizer into a river then it goes down stream and pollutes a cities drinking supply. Thats one example, but something like mountain lions, somebody from Los Angeles or San Francisco has no business voting on that. Some issues are local issues, not state issues and should be treated as such. I see what you are saying about the electoral college. I understand why its in place. But politics have changed. Our founders never could envision a day where a presidential candidate could realistically spend a billion dollars on a campaign. And the majority of that money spent on wooing the voters of a few battle ground states. This is a big problem. If a candidate could win some votes in another state they may pay attention to some issues those people in that state have. Wouldn't be nice if Obama came to Arkansas to hear what you had to say? He don't have to because you vote don't matter to him. Not that he would get your or my vote anyway lol. But with that being said, I don't feel like its the presidents job to listen to every issue every american has. Thats what we have congress for. But the electoral college allows candidates and parties to focus on a handful of states. And thats it. I have a problem with that. You think it's bad now, there's a proposition in Cali, think it's called Prop 31 that allows for "super regions" to be formed to change the flow of tax dollars/regulations. It's pretty much designed to allow cities to get tax dollars from suburbs and it going to be quite the mess if passed.
9/13/2012 5:49:41 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
pelham12345 Bronx, NY 35, joined Dec. 2011	Quote from andy505050: There is a town in California, I forget the name, but this town charges sales tax when you pay your city income tax. So if you owed 1000 in local taxes and the sale tax was 10% they'd charge you 100.00 in sales tax as well. They charge you tax to pay your taxes. Great aint it I dont see how thats remotely legal... A tax isnt a sale...
9/13/2012 11:35:42 PM	Who will be our next prez or does it really matter?
pentopaper Okmulgee, OK 50, joined Nov. 2008	War on women.... look as these two parties and see who you think has a "war on women". Would you consider it a "war on women" to want 30 year old unmarried law student liberals like Sandra Fluke to pay for her own birth control pills and not taxpayers as republicans support? Or is it a "war on women" for liberals to revere Ted Kennedy as a hero of theirs for 40 years even after he drove a woman off a bridge while drunk, leave her to die under water in his car and not report it for over 12 hours to the police?

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