8/20/2011 6:36:51 PM |
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kinkaju
Booneville, AR
71, joined Jun. 2011
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Never underestimate yourself
Meet singles at DateHookup.dating, we're 100% free! Join now!
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8/20/2011 6:46:40 PM |
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duchessa
Yonkers, NY
64, joined Aug. 2008
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Never underestimate yourself
I don't...Simply, teasing and flirting are not my talents.
[Edited 8/20/2011 6:46:56 PM ]
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8/29/2011 10:22:12 AM |
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ynghrt1
London
United Kingdom
71, joined May. 2011
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Yes, I have checked it out. Pyramids are not what I am talking about. That is a fairly universal way to build a tall massive building out of rubble and hewn stone without the benifit of an internal skeleton structure like we use today. I would expect diverse peoples to come up with that. Heck, toddlers today build pyramids out of wooden blocks to create a stable large structure and they have no architectural or engineering background yet. Anyone who needs to stack rocks does the same thing eventually.
But to depict a detailed flying object, with a pilot in it, on both sides of the ocean, before global travel and communications is what makes me go hmmm. That fact that all these stories come from about the same time in history is another factor that is not easilly explained with only terrestrial concerns.
Yes, there could be some other answer that explains this. I have yet to hear it though.
You think they are pilots in flying objects but the ones made the pictures to mean some thing else. Can you tell me where I can see these pictures please?
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8/29/2011 2:09:37 PM |
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gjlover
Grand Junction, CO
54, joined Aug. 2010
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I don't know what the answer is, but when I see a drawing like this, it makes me wonder just what they were trying to depict
http://indiansspaceshipsangelsandjesusmovie.wordpress.com/2010/04/22/hatonn-mayan-indian-carvingan-astronaut/
There are also other carvings of people in weird helmets that look like astronaut helmets, but could very well just be elaborate headdresses. There are also carvings of craft that can only be described as Airplanes or Spaceships, but it could be some stylized attempt to picture a bird or flying fish, but they look too mechanical to be a biological subject.
http://www.google.com/search?q=ancient+airplane&hl=en&biw=1024&bih=602&prmd=ivns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=huRbTuWkMcqpsALC_aieDA&sqi=2&ved=0CC4QsAQ
Sorry for the external links, not keen on filling up my photobucket with these images.
Chariots of the Gods has been published in many languages, I reccomend you read that book. It does not provide any answers, but it asks a lot of questions.
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8/30/2011 11:43:35 AM |
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tyra1462
Canyon Country, CA
38, joined Aug. 2011
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how can any1 not believe in this theory? !? evidence is right there n front of us...
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8/30/2011 12:22:02 PM |
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duchessa
Yonkers, NY
64, joined Aug. 2008
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gjlover
I PROMISE TO YOU TO FIND AND POST THE ENGLISH VERSION OF THIS VIDEO....AMAZING
[Edited 8/30/2011 12:22:57 PM ]
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8/30/2011 8:07:31 PM |
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duchessa
Yonkers, NY
64, joined Aug. 2008
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8/31/2011 12:40:56 AM |
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ynghrt1
London
United Kingdom
71, joined May. 2011
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I don't know what the answer is, but when I see a drawing like this, it makes me wonder just what they were trying to depict
http://indiansspaceshipsangelsandjesusmovie.wordpress.com/2010/04/22/hatonn-mayan-indian-carvingan-astronaut/
There are also other carvings of people in weird helmets that look like astronaut helmets, but could very well just be elaborate headdresses. There are also carvings of craft that can only be described as Airplanes or Spaceships, but it could be some stylized attempt to picture a bird or flying fish, but they look too mechanical to be a biological subject.
http://www.google.com/search?q=ancient+airplane&hl=en&biw=1024&bih=602&prmd=ivns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=huRbTuWkMcqpsALC_aieDA&sqi=2&ved=0CC4QsAQ
Sorry for the external links, not keen on filling up my photobucket with these images.
Chariots of the Gods has been published in many languages, I reccomend you read that book. It does not provide any answers, but it asks a lot of questions.
Many thanks for the links.
I have seen some pictures. They resemble flying objects but none of them are aerodynamic. Each picture combines resemblance to insects, lizards and fish. It is an artistic creativity and has nothing to do with flying objects. All artists of that time were getting inspiration from nature and nature is the same all around. This explains why each one of them made similar things although lived very far from each other. They didn't made these things to represent some thing was flying. This is our interpretation, not theirs. They made these things to mean some thing else.
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8/31/2011 12:42:39 AM |
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ynghrt1
London
United Kingdom
71, joined May. 2011
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how can any1 not believe in this theory? !? evidence is right there n front of us...
Things are not as simple as we see them. We read these evidences incorrectly.
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8/31/2011 2:23:56 AM |
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kinkaju
Booneville, AR
71, joined Jun. 2011
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Many thanks for the links.
I have seen some pictures. They resemble flying objects but none of them are aerodynamic. Each picture combines resemblance to insects, lizards and fish. It is an artistic creativity and has nothing to do with flying objects. All artists of that time were getting inspiration from nature and nature is the same all around. This explains why each one of them made similar things although lived very far from each other. They didn't made these things to represent some thing was flying. This is our interpretation, not theirs. They made these things to mean some thing else.
Ok not nesesarily discounting your statement only questioning an assumption .
the lunar lander was not aerodynamic either(I realize the moon has no atmosphere)
but depending on aerodynamic is only needed at higher speeds(notice mans early aircraft and automobiles)in space (outside the atmosphere) aerodynamics are not a factor.
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8/31/2011 4:05:34 AM |
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ynghrt1
London
United Kingdom
71, joined May. 2011
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Ok not nesesarily discounting your statement only questioning an assumption .
the lunar lander was not aerodynamic either(I realize the moon has no atmosphere)
but depending on aerodynamic is only needed at higher speeds(notice mans early aircraft and automobiles)in space (outside the atmosphere) aerodynamics are not a factor.
I agree with your points. But these pictures have wings but they are not aerodynamic, just look at the heads and necks. lunar lander didn't need wing. It was not flying in an atmosphere. In these old pictures you can see wings and tails as aerodynamic means. But the head and nick are not aerodynamic. So obviously these pictures don't depict something like UFO.
Well, in any case even if these ancient people visited by alien in UFOs or these aliens visit us, what is the benefits of it? nothing, except some extra business for publicity companies.
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8/31/2011 7:00:44 AM |
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arkiebama
Union Grove, AL
68, joined Jun. 2011
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I agree with your points. But these pictures have wings but they are not aerodynamic, just look at the heads and necks. lunar lander didn't need wing. It was not flying in an atmosphere. In these old pictures you can see wings and tails as aerodynamic means. But the head and nick are not aerodynamic. So obviously these pictures don't depict something like UFO.
Well, in any case even if these ancient people visited by alien in UFOs or these aliens visit us, what is the benefits of it? nothing, except some extra business for publicity companies.
do you think ancient people knew about aerodynamics ? of course not.
they just drawed what they saw. (or as close to it as they could understand).
hypothetically,,, if a ancient painting was found of a car and everything looked
right except it had square wheels would you dismiss it as a random drawing because it
wouldn't be road worthy ?
to illustrate my point ask a child to draw a airplane. i'll bet my next social security
check it wouldn't be aerodynamic.i doubt if 'I' could draw a airplane that would be aerodynamic.
just saying they didn't draw ''anything'' to scale.
(( what is the benefits of it? nothing, except some extra business for publicity companies)))
Why do 'WE' explore space? i think its possible for us to discover primitive worlds
in the next 100 years or so. what will they think of our technology? could they understand it ?
sorry if i misunderstood your post.
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8/31/2011 9:28:31 AM |
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duchessa
Yonkers, NY
64, joined Aug. 2008
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do you think ancient people knew about aerodynamics ? of course not.
they just drawed what they saw. (or as close to it as they could understand).
and then...maybe they did; their intelligence, knowledge and skills are more than evident.
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8/31/2011 10:54:30 AM |
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arkiebama
Union Grove, AL
68, joined Jun. 2011
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and then...maybe they did; their intelligence, knowledge and skills are more than evident.
evident? such as ??
i believe they did some increatable things but not without
some kind of help.
but my point is, you can't make a decision based on wheather or not a painting
or sculpture was aerodynamic.
btw.. if they understood aerodynamics wouldn't you think we would find paintings
of simple gliders instead of complicated jet airplains (even if they wasn't aerodynamic)
oh hell,,, what are we talking about? we know GOD did it.
isn't that the way it works? if you can't explain it, god did it.lol
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8/31/2011 12:03:37 PM |
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kinkaju
Booneville, AR
71, joined Jun. 2011
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as far as I can tell It remains unproven so I can't discount it out-of hand I have no way to say yea or nay ,it must remain an open possibility untill such time that it is proven or dismissed by facts .
I may never know the truth in my life time but I will remain open to searching for any information.
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8/31/2011 12:04:48 PM |
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jugglebug
Green Valley, AZ
57, joined Aug. 2011
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Wow, I can't believe there are so many Fans of the History channel here
As for me I am a Truck driver so I know how heavy a fully loaded Tractor Trailer is, now 40 tons is a lot of weight and some of the Big blocks of Limestone used to build the Pyramids in Egypt are 80 tons or more......So we are expected to believe that Cave men drug these Heavy stones across Desert sand OR they floated these Blocks on simple log rafts down the Nile.......Eh, I don't so. I say this because I have seen, as many of you good People have what happens when a loaded Semi loses its brakes and has to hit the Runaway ramps off the Interstate in the High Mountain areas, It takes a BIG Tow Truck to pull these Semi's out of that Gravel Ramp. These Big Tow Trucks have 550 hp CAT engines in them, so there is NO way that 200 cave men drug those Stone blocks across the sand.
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8/31/2011 1:41:24 PM |
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kinkaju
Booneville, AR
71, joined Jun. 2011
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evident? such as ??
i believe they did some increatable things but not without
some kind of help.
but my point is, you can't make a decision based on wheather or not a painting
or sculpture was aerodynamic.
btw.. if they understood aerodynamics wouldn't you think we would find paintings
of simple gliders instead of complicated jet airplains (even if they wasn't aerodynamic)
oh hell,,, what are we talking about? we know GOD did it.
isn't that the way it works? if you can't explain it, god did it.lol
damn good to see ya back again...thought you wuz abducted by some preachers daughter
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8/31/2011 2:34:58 PM |
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arkiebama
Union Grove, AL
68, joined Jun. 2011
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lmao!! not yet kink. i've been taking a short break from the threads.
i'm a quite type of a guy. sometimes i just don't feel like talking..lol
but i'm back, you better lock up your mamas and daughters....lol
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8/31/2011 2:37:44 PM |
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arkiebama
Union Grove, AL
68, joined Jun. 2011
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Wow, I can't believe there are so many Fans of the History channel here ::sign cool::
As for me I am a Truck driver so I know how heavy a fully loaded Tractor Trailer is, now 40 tons is a lot of weight and some of the Big blocks of Limestone used to build the Pyramids in Egypt are 80 tons or more......So we are expected to believe that Cave men drug these Heavy stones across Desert sand OR they floated these Blocks on simple log rafts down the Nile.......Eh, I don't so. I say this because I have seen, as many of you good People have what happens when a loaded Semi loses its brakes and has to hit the Runaway ramps off the Interstate in the High Mountain areas, It takes a BIG Tow Truck to pull these Semi's out of that Gravel Ramp. These Big Tow Trucks have 550 hp CAT engines in them, so there is NO way that 200 cave men drug those Stone blocks across the sand.
i agree with ye jb. i've been a heavy equipment mechanic most of my adult life.
and 80 tons is quit a load. equal to approx 5o cars. (if my calculations are correct)
according to people 'in the know', there was no way to grow enough food in that area
to sustain a work force large enough to move stones that big. much less move them hundreds of miles and stack them one on top of the other.
yep! i watch a bunch of history channel.. LOL i spend a lot of time watching videos
on things like this.
it makes me wonder what was so important about these structures, that they would spend
so much time and effort on.
its hard for me to believe that some guy woke up one morning and said, HEY i have a great idea, lets spend the rest of our lives draging those big stones and stack them in the middle of the desert..it just doesn't make sense.
what i can't understand is why scientist is not trying harder to figure it out.
i believe if this puzzle was solved it would answer the question of a 'so called'god.
JMHO
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8/31/2011 4:00:37 PM |
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duchessa
Yonkers, NY
64, joined Aug. 2008
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evident? such as ??
Well....there are certain buildings known as pyramids, tombs, cities, mountain roads that make their knowledge quite obvious...
BTW, ask your former boss how much it cost a log cabin...I now know you are in touch with him
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8/31/2011 4:04:50 PM |
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duchessa
Yonkers, NY
64, joined Aug. 2008
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jugglebug
Welcome.
I don't know either how these huge stones were moved around by the Egyptians, Mayans, Aztecs and / or Incas...but I find hard to believe a guy seating on a cloud did it for them.
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8/31/2011 4:29:24 PM |
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arkiebama
Union Grove, AL
68, joined Jun. 2011
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Well....there are certain buildings known as pyramids, tombs, cities, mountain roads that make their knowledge quite obvious...
BTW, ask your former boss how much it cost a log cabin...I now know you are in touch with him
that only proves these things exist. it doesn't prove "they" built them without
outside help. i thought this was the purpose of this thread.
naa, he's out of the building bussiness except for his personal stuff. like i showed you
when you were here. all he does now is dirt work. bull dozers,back hoes,track hoes and such.
its hard to say how much it cost to build one because he has his own timber and saw mills. if you had to buy the lumber from a lumber yard it's no telling what it would cost. i doubt if one cost him over 20 or 30 grand. i still live in one of those cabins.
but its free for me.. i guess thats my bonus for working my a** off for 20 years,,lol
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8/31/2011 4:45:32 PM |
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gjlover
Grand Junction, CO
54, joined Aug. 2010
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jugglebug
Welcome.
I don't know either how these huge stones were moved around by the Egyptians, Mayans, Aztecs and / or Incas...but I find hard to believe a guy seating on a cloud did it for them.
A couple of thousand motivated people can move a mountain with hand tools given enough time. Researchers have solved most of the technical challenges that faced the builders back then using tools/techniques that would have been around at the time.
[Edited 8/31/2011 4:46:06 PM ]
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8/31/2011 4:50:43 PM |
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duchessa
Yonkers, NY
64, joined Aug. 2008
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A couple of thousand motivated people can move a mountain with hand tools given enough time. Researchers have solved most of the technical challenges that faced the builders back then using tools/techniques that would have been around at the time.
Now, how many thousands people would be necessary to move an 800 T stone?
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8/31/2011 5:32:36 PM |
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gjlover
Grand Junction, CO
54, joined Aug. 2010
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Now, how many thousands people would be necessary to move an 800 T stone?
I did not say it would be easy.......
It all depends on the coeeficient of friction of the surface. One well conditioned man can move a 22 ton locomotive that is on rails. So, 40 to move a 800 ton locomotive. So, doing some math, making some assumptions, a swag or two, I figure 200 to 400 could move 800 tons on log rollers on a dirt surface.
I went to bank vault that had a multi ton door that I could move with my pinky, and I was a kid at the time. Of course it was well balanced.
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8/31/2011 5:41:45 PM |
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duchessa
Yonkers, NY
64, joined Aug. 2008
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I did not say it would be easy.......
It all depends on the coeeficient of friction of the surface. One well conditioned man can move a 22 ton locomotive that is on rails. So, 40 to move a 800 ton locomotive. So, doing some math, making some assumptions, a swag or two, I figure 200 to 400 could move 800 tons on log rollers on a dirt surface.
I went to bank vault that had a multi ton door that I could move with my pinky, and I was a kid at the time. Of course it was well balanced.
Where did they get the wooden log rollers? Remember, the pyramids are in the Sahara.
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8/31/2011 5:55:58 PM |
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kinkaju
Booneville, AR
71, joined Jun. 2011
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Where did they get the wooden log rollers? Remember, the pyramids are in the Sahara.
there is also the problem of sand as a former heavy equipt.operator I can tell you that sand in an arid place such the sahara is not the same as firm pact dirt.now you can wet the sands and improve traction but thats another problem not a lot of water there.
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8/31/2011 6:13:03 PM |
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arkiebama
Union Grove, AL
68, joined Jun. 2011
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Now, how many thousands people would be necessary to move an 800 T stone?
it would take a thousand men(just a guess) to move a 80 ton stone. but how long would it take to for them to move it 300 miles? i seen a video that said one of the piramids took 20 years to build. but they claim there was not enough people in that area to get the job done in 20 years.
i have seen where people tried to move the giant stoness using ancient tools that were available in the area but failed.
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8/31/2011 6:20:09 PM |
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arkiebama
Union Grove, AL
68, joined Jun. 2011
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Where did they get the wooden log rollers? Remember, the pyramids are in the Sahara.
hell yeah,, NOW its a desert. i use to be a logger in the great searra forest.
but it was a desert when i got through with it..
[Edited 8/31/2011 6:21:25 PM ]
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9/1/2011 1:09:20 AM |
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ynghrt1
London
United Kingdom
71, joined May. 2011
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Wow, I can't believe there are so many Fans of the History channel here
As for me I am a Truck driver so I know how heavy a fully loaded Tractor Trailer is, now 40 tons is a lot of weight and some of the Big blocks of Limestone used to build the Pyramids in Egypt are 80 tons or more......So we are expected to believe that Cave men drug these Heavy stones across Desert sand OR they floated these Blocks on simple log rafts down the Nile.......Eh, I don't so. I say this because I have seen, as many of you good People have what happens when a loaded Semi loses its brakes and has to hit the Runaway ramps off the Interstate in the High Mountain areas, It takes a BIG Tow Truck to pull these Semi's out of that Gravel Ramp. These Big Tow Trucks have 550 hp CAT engines in them, so there is NO way that 200 cave men drug those Stone blocks across the sand.
80 tone is a peanut to move if you know how. Thousands of people were working on pyramid as a religious duty and getting a good reward, a house and food, which is similar to high paid wages of today. They were using levers. When you know how to use lever with use of a lot of people you can move any thing heavy simply by rolling it for example.
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9/1/2011 9:41:40 AM |
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gjlover
Grand Junction, CO
54, joined Aug. 2010
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Where did they get the wooden log rollers? Remember, the pyramids are in the Sahara.
There were trees in the area. The Nile river valley was a lush green place back then. It was basically deforested back in the time of the pyramids. Same thing happened with the Maya and Inca's, they cut down so many trees they destroyed the ecosystem that supported them. It is what is believed to have happended to the people in Mesa Verde. Besides, there was ship based trade in the Mediterrian, so they could have just bought them.
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9/1/2011 10:22:17 AM |
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kinkaju
Booneville, AR
71, joined Jun. 2011
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What amazes me is that to cut the stones so accuratly that they fit .
were any shards found from where they cut the stones or were they cut at a quarry ?
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9/1/2011 12:39:33 PM |
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gjlover
Grand Junction, CO
54, joined Aug. 2010
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The center of the pyramids is basically rubble, so that is probably where the shards and cast offs are. But, you can create accurate right angles with nothing more than a plumb bob. Limestone and sandstone are fairly easy to shape. I don't remember what the Mayan and Inca pyramids and temples were made out of, but I think that stone is harder.
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9/1/2011 3:24:06 PM |
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kinkaju
Booneville, AR
71, joined Jun. 2011
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Yes a plumb bob will get a right angle but to maintain 3 Dimentional cube is quite an accomplishment with primitive tools .not saying it can't/wasn't done just would love to have been there to watch.
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9/1/2011 4:20:32 PM |
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duchessa
Yonkers, NY
64, joined Aug. 2008
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There were trees in the area. The Nile river valley was a lush green place back then. It was basically deforested back in the time of the pyramids. Same thing happened with the Maya and Inca's, they cut down so many trees they destroyed the ecosystem that supported them. It is what is believed to have happended to the people in Mesa Verde. Besides, there was ship based trade in the Mediterrian, so they could have just bought them.
The Nile overflowed...yes....but i don't think many trees were there as to use them as rollers.
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9/1/2011 4:22:15 PM |
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duchessa
Yonkers, NY
64, joined Aug. 2008
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The center of the pyramids is basically rubble, so that is probably where the shards and cast offs are. But, you can create accurate right angles with nothing more than a plumb bob. Limestone and sandstone are fairly easy to shape. I don't remember what the Mayan and Inca pyramids and temples were made out of, but I think that stone is harder.
Well, but the "computer precision' of the cuts is something awesome. Nope, no an easy sill to get.
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9/1/2011 5:36:01 PM |
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kinkaju
Booneville, AR
71, joined Jun. 2011
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Well, but the "computer precision' of the cuts is something awesome. Nope, no an easy sill to get.
especially over an 8ft or larger cube . maintaining a planar surface in not easy to do even with modern equiptment.
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9/1/2011 6:49:46 PM |
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dpdrinker23
Fredericktown, MO
30, joined Aug. 2011
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its a viable. theory... I keep seeing it more and more... I almost agree with it...
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9/2/2011 11:17:17 AM |
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joelallen83
Waxahachie, TX
34, joined Jul. 2011
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Has anyone here actually thought how difficult it would be to make the 4 shafts that come out of the Great Pyramid?
There are 2 coming otu of both rooms -- the Kings room, and queens room -- and there was a little camera bot thing that drove up one of them. they are perfectly square, and smooth all the way up. half way up the shaft, there is a door leading into another room with a small door on the other side.
ancient tool your way out of that precarious situation.
I'll just toss this up here -- http://www.squidoo.com/the-secret-doors-inside-the-great-pyramid
Also, how do we get blocks of vitrified granite formed to shape (Mayans? Peruvian holy site?) in ancient societies?
modern technology struggles to do that, if it even can.
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9/2/2011 12:13:46 PM |
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arkiebama
Union Grove, AL
68, joined Jun. 2011
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Has anyone here actually thought how difficult it would be to make the 4 shafts that come out of the Great Pyramid?
There are 2 coming out of both rooms -- the Kings room, and queens room -- and there was a little camera bot thing that drove up one of them. they are perfectly square, and smooth all the way up. half way up the shaft, there is a door leading into another room with a small door on the other side.
ancient tool your way out of that precarious situation.
I'll just toss this up here -- http://www.squidoo.com/the-secret-doors-inside-the-great-pyramid
Also, how do we get blocks of vitrified granite formed to shape (Mayans? Peruvian holy site?) in ancient societies?
modern technology struggles to do that, if it even can.
some think the pyramids were used as a power source and that was the reason for the shafts from the kings and queens rooms. they think salt was poured in one shaft and somehow created hydrogen. (i forgot exactly how it was done).
but i'm not sure i believe that are not. but it would explain why the pyramids was so important to them. i'm sorry but i can't remember the video i seen that in.
it would also explain how they could paint inside a dark cave and leave no signs of
smut or anything that would indicate they used torches for light. hence the reason for the bagdad battery.
like i said, i'm not sure i buy that theory but its something to think about.
[Edited 9/2/2011 12:16:24 PM ]
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9/3/2011 9:53:41 AM |
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joelallen83
Waxahachie, TX
34, joined Jul. 2011
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that theory is pretty prominant. has to do with the obelisks and directing power to something far away. the ancient aliens documentary talks about it.
obelisks are theorized to have been used as sort of power towers (similar to how modern day day radio towers work)
it's some really cool stuff to think about especially with all the technological advances that could be persued that way.. there are sort of 'electric power towers' being invented today. neat stuffs.
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9/3/2011 11:15:34 AM |
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arkiebama
Union Grove, AL
68, joined Jun. 2011
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are you referring to "HAARP"
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9/12/2011 8:24:24 PM |
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spacelazorz
Elkhart, IN
36, joined Aug. 2011
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I will say, the only thing that keeps me from being completely athiestic is a few issues I have
1. science states that something doesn't come from nothing
2. where did all matter come from to formulate the big bang?
3. where did the laws of physics and quantum mechanics come from?
A1
Science doesn't state. The laws of thermodynamics show that energy can't be destroyed.
A2
Before the big bang there was a mass of antimatter and matter. When they meet, they explode and cancle each other out of existence. There just happened to be more matter than antimatter and it makes up all the matter in the known universe today. They do not know why there was more matter than antimatter.
A3
Mankind. The forces behind them most believe can be accounted for down to a single or set of fundimental "querks" of nature. I don't know if you'll grasp my explination here. The theory of everything "unified field theory" would probably explain how it's possible. Although it's still unknown.
"just look at the current population of the slackers that live off of the government"
Um, yeah if you want to call that living. I don't see how that has anything to do with ignorant people necessesarily. I think that's only talking about people unfortunate generally.
The big bang is absolutely nothing like a combustion engine. Unless you count it as an explosion, but if comparing it to such helps you to dream of how it occures naturally than so be it. There is no known explination for how universes are created, but the rubber band "big suck" "implosion theory" is not reality. And it's just as likely that our universe was created by some type of being, or even god, as it is to have happened all on it's own.
The biggest mistake people make when thinking about existence, is to think of it as physical. Consider your brain waves, you think, therefor you are. Meaning as far as humans can tell our brain waves exist. But are they physical? Are they real? Do they actually exist? Probably not how you think. Atomic particals are also waves, and just as you can hear two songs at once, the particle waves could make up several universes at once.
What'll really get you thinking, is that the waves of your mind, of a song, of light, and of matter, are all very much the same. When you play a sing on a guitar, some trace of that song probably lives on within the particles of wood itself. And some religions believe objects possess spirits or aura.
On a side note, It's also known that praying generates energy. Which is part of the ancient aliens program.
I don't know if aliens have visited earth, the numbers say probably not. but there is a lot of edvidence to the case. Do not believe everything you read though. AA program talks about stone henge as a possible landing site. It was not, at the same time they were filming new evidence that clearly showed it was a religious cerimony. And although contemporary sciences can't explain the creation of certain formations, there is no reason to give any credit to the stories in the bible, and there is no reason to believe that it requires divinity, aliens, or anything else.
Perhaps the building technology was lost. I would say the current population of the world indicates that many gave their lives and that ancient civilizations and people were a whole hell of a lot smarter than people would naturally give them credit for.
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9/12/2011 8:45:44 PM |
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spacelazorz
Elkhart, IN
36, joined Aug. 2011
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Where did they get the wooden log rollers? Remember, the pyramids are in the Sahara.
So you're saying it's more likely that extraterrestrials travelled lightyears to move a couple rocks and leave no other evidence behind than for the egyptians to have travelled a ways to get some wood?
How do you know for sure it wasn't already there, or that they didn't have glass rollers, stone, or some technology that completely escapes modern methods?
The ancient astronaughts theory is very shakey at best, even with all the mysteries the world still holds. Any technology significantly more advanced is indistinguishable from magic, and usually chucked up to god or aliens or whatever.
We don't know, that is all the conclusion anyone claiming anything scientific should think until evidence presents itself. Skepticism is how we all became atheist, and you want to throw that out the window to believe a couple nerds that want creatures with 3 tits?
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9/13/2011 9:38:48 AM |
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gjlover
Grand Junction, CO
54, joined Aug. 2010
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So you're saying it's more likely that extraterrestrials travelled lightyears to move a couple rocks and leave no other evidence behind than for the egyptians to have travelled a ways to get some wood?
I don't think the Aliens built the pyramids or other ancient edifices. I don't think all the motivation for people building these things was Aliens. However, for some of them, like the Nazca Lines and certain carvings, extra-terrestrial influence offer the best theory. The lines could have been made by folks who wanted to communicate with them (whether they thought they existed or not, kind of like our SETI efforts) or by folks who wanted to offer an homage either to the thought of aliens or their actual visit. It could have been some impressive meteor showers that gave people all over the world the idea that something was up in the sky.
Who knows, all we have to work with are partial records that happen to have been carved into rocks and tablets of a language we don't completely, but mostly, understand. Most of the knowledge of these folks is gone and we can only guess at what they knew and thought.
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9/14/2011 3:20:19 PM |
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walksnshadows
Minneapolis, MN
72, joined Jun. 2011
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I have read this entire thread and have done some studying on my own but do not claim to know it all or even as much as some of you. The one thing I strongly believe is that there has to be another form of intelligence in the universe. To think that we are the only ones is to be incredibly nieve. They may be close or they could be on the outer regions of the universe, galaxy, wherever. IMHO we have had visitors that have "stopped by" to give us little bits of information from time to time to see if we are intelligent enough to use it. It is the use of this information that gets us more and more as time passes.
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9/14/2011 3:55:07 PM |
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grignon
Warrenville, IL
60, joined Oct. 2010
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The last thing I'd do is reject ancient, unsupported woo documents like the bible, vedas and koran and then embrace a modern one like chariots of the gods.
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9/15/2011 7:42:57 PM |
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gjlover
Grand Junction, CO
54, joined Aug. 2010
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The big difference is Chariots asks questions and invites you to think where the religous tomes provide answers that can't be questioned.
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9/16/2011 9:56:44 AM |
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kinkaju
Booneville, AR
71, joined Jun. 2011
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The last thing I'd do is reject ancient, unsupported woo documents like the bible, vedas and koran and then embrace a modern one like chariots of the gods.
You are right but my outlook is that if someone has proof that god exists then I will evaluate the proof and can change my outlook.but it has to be proof not faith.It has not been proven yet to my satisfaction in 64 years.
I will admit I don't have all the answers , but I am willing to learn.
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9/16/2011 1:19:02 PM |
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spacelazorz
Elkhart, IN
36, joined Aug. 2011
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To understand the numbers behind the likelyhood of other life in the universe is to also understand the unlikelyhood that they have ever visited earth.
Also there is the native american argument like hawkings decribes, ignorant natives aren't the concern of more advanced civilizations and ESPECIALLY different races of beings.
One thing I have learned about crazy theories is this... no matter what "evidence" is presented, never buy into a single report or loose story. It's easy to piece random things together and make it all fit. And it needs to happen often to even be worth noting.
People want to believe in aliens as much as god and bigfoot. Take the bermuda triangle.. it's like 1/3 of the atlantic ocean lol.. oh so mysterious.. like those guys who build crop circles.
Some people want to build the world up proper, some want to destroy it, some want to confuse others with riddles and pranks, and others are just stupid.
There are no "aliens", there is no "god", there is no "bigfoot". Giant squid however... not everything is bullshit, just most of it.
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9/16/2011 2:04:10 PM |
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joelallen83
Waxahachie, TX
34, joined Jul. 2011
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The crop circles built by men look nothing like the ones that mysteriously appeared.
The main problem of both extreme religious people and extreme athiesm is the view that everything is a sign of a diety or everything is not a sign for anything...
My agnostic views really state that something is out there. Diety, intelligent or just further along in evolution than us. I tend to shy away from diety and religion all together. Soething further evolved seems better off.
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9/16/2011 3:04:47 PM |
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gjlover
Grand Junction, CO
54, joined Aug. 2010
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To understand the numbers behind the likelyhood of other life in the universe is to also understand the unlikelyhood that they have ever visited earth.
I am sure we are quite boring to beings that use the Milky Way as a superhighway.
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9/16/2011 4:56:40 PM |
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joelallen83
Waxahachie, TX
34, joined Jul. 2011
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here's what people have to rationalize. way back when, the universe was hella smaller. hella smaller. there was a previous star shere our solar system is now. there is a TON of possiblities out there.. limitless. some terrestrial entity could have visited us at any time in our past. could be hovering just outside the view of our telescopes or where we aren't or haven't looked yet. ... or on the other side of the sun waiting for something.
yes, a one in a million chance oftheir being life smarter than us is being rather 'generous' but also very likely considering how many stars, solar systems, galaxies and universes there are out there. .. and the age of everything.. a galaxy whos light has been traveling several thousand light years to get here means there is a galaxy at least several thousand years old.. .. and probably hundreds of thousands times older than that.
rationalizing, or dismissing the likliness of an alien race visiting us because it is easier to dismiss a deity is probably not the mot intelligent thing to do.. HOWEVER, both are not terribly provable with the information we have now... but an ancient civilization/terrestrial being can leave physical marks on the earth and probably has already...
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9/17/2011 4:36:06 PM |
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ram9906
North Aurora, IL
25, joined Sep. 2011
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love thz show i nevr missed one episode
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9/17/2011 8:55:21 PM |
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duchessa
Yonkers, NY
64, joined Aug. 2008
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I am sure we are quite boring to beings that use the Milky Way as a superhighway.
Star Treck...2011 version?
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9/23/2011 9:46:28 AM |
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lcbotzz
Staten Island, NY
32, joined Jun. 2009
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this aliens theory is exaclty like a religion....everybody needs soomething else to be above the human race...ever think mb we are dominant species in our universe?
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9/23/2011 4:18:56 PM |
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spacelazorz
Elkhart, IN
36, joined Aug. 2011
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Ok hold up, let me explain myself better.
First off I have always known there ARE extra terrestrials, and that there is NO god.
How do I know this? Is it because I choose a stance and stick with it? No, not really.
I question, the nature of the stories, the evidence if you can call it that.
IF aliens had come to earth, why instead of pyrimids didn't they leave better evidence? If they're so advanced why is a rock the only thing they considered for future humans?
No, it's true that many civilizations share common myths, but what's the likelyhood that out of the many many different types of alien depictions that many many types of aliens would have taken the same route for humanity.
And if aliens did know about us, and we have to assume not all aliens are good natured, how come 1 type of them hasn't enslaved or killed us all by now?
Aliens don't give a shit about us, why would they? Do you aspire to travel to other worlds to play kindergarten teacher? If you do that's sad.
As for god.. it's like a basic scam.. do good, get rewarded, do bad, get punished for enternity.. I mean it just wreaks of bullshit.
See my stance is a skeptical one, I know that anything is possible and some things are far more likely than others. It's impossible that Jesus was a real man and that the bible is the only record of his existence, and it's highly unlikely that aliens have visited earth.
But nothing is impossible, go on, keep your faith alive. But if you want it to survive, this probably isn't the best place to nurture it.
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9/26/2011 2:31:30 PM |
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brock_hardwood
Fairfield, CA
43, joined Jun. 2010
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"Extraodinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan.
Ancient human intelligence: Evolution works very slowly. Humans of 10,000 years ago had roughly the same reasoning capacity as we do. They may not have had the same collection of information we have, but they were still intelligent. Not realizing this is the starting point of most of the flawed reasoning in this thread.
Ancient global communication: requires little more than people going from place to place and carrying with them, ideas. If only a fraction of population traveled 50 miles a year and an even smaller fraction traveled the seas, ideas could easily spread across the globe in a very short time.
The pyramids: It doesn't take a degree in rocket science to figure out how to stack heavy rocks onto heavy rocks or to move rocks from one place to another, especially when there is a river close by and there is an abundance of cheap labor. As for our abilities to build them today, of course we can. We have buildings in every major city that are many times more complex and amazing. If the empire state building were build 5,000 years ago, I might be impressed. Furthermore, it is entirely reasonable to expect an advanced civilization to build that instead.
Alien similarities: The key similarity is that they are humanoid, which isn't all that surprising given the source of imagination is humans. Also, there is a potential confirmation bias logical fallacy at work here...Any thing that didn't look human could have been interpreted as creative animal drawings and been subsequently ignored in order to make the argument that they are all similar.
Modern evolutionary theory clearly shows, by way of physical evidence, common descent over the course of 3.5 billion years. The earth at that time would have most likely been of little interest to traveling aliens.
The likelihood that any alien civilization would even consider coming here also has problems. With 200 billion stars in this galaxy, even if there were a MILLION star traveling alien civilizations, there would still be a 1 in 200,000 probability that any one of them would choose to travel to ours.
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9/27/2011 5:19:50 AM |
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spacelazorz
Elkhart, IN
36, joined Aug. 2011
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"Extraodinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan.
Ancient human intelligence: Evolution works very slowly. Humans of 10,000 years ago had roughly the same reasoning capacity as we do. They may not have had the same collection of information we have, but they were still intelligent. Not realizing this is the starting point of most of the flawed reasoning in this thread.
Ancient global communication: requires little more than people going from place to place and carrying with them, ideas. If only a fraction of population traveled 50 miles a year and an even smaller fraction traveled the seas, ideas could easily spread across the globe in a very short time.
The pyramids: It doesn't take a degree in rocket science to figure out how to stack heavy rocks onto heavy rocks or to move rocks from one place to another, especially when there is a river close by and there is an abundance of cheap labor. As for our abilities to build them today, of course we can. We have buildings in every major city that are many times more complex and amazing. If the empire state building were build 5,000 years ago, I might be impressed. Furthermore, it is entirely reasonable to expect an advanced civilization to build that instead.
Alien similarities: The key similarity is that they are humanoid, which isn't all that surprising given the source of imagination is humans. Also, there is a potential confirmation bias logical fallacy at work here...Any thing that didn't look human could have been interpreted as creative animal drawings and been subsequently ignored in order to make the argument that they are all similar.
Modern evolutionary theory clearly shows, by way of physical evidence, common descent over the course of 3.5 billion years. The earth at that time would have most likely been of little interest to traveling aliens.
The likelihood that any alien civilization would even consider coming here also has problems. With 200 billion stars in this galaxy, even if there were a MILLION star traveling alien civilizations, there would still be a 1 in 200,000 probability that any one of them would choose to travel to ours.
Finally a worthy opponent.
"Extraodinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan.
You are aware that a lot of "evidence" comes in the form of mathematical calculation right? I'm not sure where you were pointing this gun, but if it's towards my claims of knowing that ET's exist than I base that simply on simple math, which seems to work in every other area of my life.
"Evolution works very slowly." -> Cambrian explosion.
"Ancient global communication: requires little more than people going from place to place and carrying with them, ideas." -> the evidence shows this didn't happen though, which is the reason for the mystery. I tend to believe it did though, and that somehow the record was lost, or perhaps I agree more with another poster about the human mind coming up with similar ideas.
"The pyramids: It doesn't take a degree in rocket science to figure out how to stack heavy rocks onto heavy rocks or to move rocks from one place to another" -> you're correct, it requires a firm understanding of architecture and physics. Nothing requires a degree except employment oppertunities. Although the pyramids and shitloads of other ancient structures still can't be replicated today, logs or no logs, lifting some of the structures into place would have required access to equipment they simply didn't have, not only that but the way in which some of the stones are fused together or cut is completely beyond contemporary methods. There is definate mystery in this realm and some of the strongest evidence for the wild claims at hand.
However I agree completely that advanced beings create advanced structures. But these types of structures aren't meant for office work or as domiciles, they are more like memorials or monuments in most cases, very much like what you see in the contemorary world. And stone is also one of the few things economically ideal for making something which will last for many millenia, and that very much indicates who or what ever built those structures wanted them around for some reason. I don't know about you but I don't care how much someone believes in gods or living deities, you don't build massive monuments as a grave, your slaves would sooner die than serve that purpose, and your jailors would have been over thrown. But still there is no reason to think it was aliens just yet.
"Alien similarities: The key similarity is that they are humanoid" -> ah, your greatest contribution here. Very, very good point to make. This also works on deities, mankind is a weak minded creature when it comes down to it. When one raises up idols, one creates them with limited vision, and the truly clever cults turned it around like a strawman and said god(s) create us in their image. But all of us know that the truth has been spun there.
And that should give you the answer, people put a spin on everything, not just ideas but on buildings, on culture, on stories... but never forget, the giant squid is real.. and I have been into this conspiracy shit ever since they told me a carpenter built the world. And the last god damned thing I expected to be real was the giant sea creatures...
I believe.. that if not yesterday, or today.. providing we hold back the pearly gates crashing down on us. That someday mankind will have a chess partner other then ourselves.. but that's probably not going to be a fun game.
And I should have stopped there, but just let me say the last two paragraphs you wrote are complete shit.. come on with those figures, you pulled that straight out of your a** and you know it. But good show man, good to see I'm not the only super geek around.
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9/28/2011 3:26:03 PM |
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brock_hardwood
Fairfield, CA
43, joined Jun. 2010
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I love your optimism. I'm not so sure it is warranted, but who knows? lol
I'm going to take your response one piece at a time...
Finally a worthy opponent.
"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan.
You are aware that a lot of "evidence" comes in the form of mathematical calculation right? I'm not sure where you were pointing this gun, but if it's towards my claims of knowing that ET's exist than I base that simply on simple math, which seems to work in every other area of my life.
Mathematical calculation is NOT evidence, it is at best, analysis of evidence. This leaves us with one question: What is the evidence?
First off, we have to decide what qualifies as evidence. I tend to favor the scientific view of it. First is that it needs to be empirical, that is, information obtained by observation or experiment by any one of the 5 senses. It needs to be objective, meaning that it is not subject to personal bias. For example, the mass of a rock might be 5kg and regardless of whether someone believes in gravity or not, every observer using properly calibrated equipment would arrive at the same 5kg conclusion whether they wanted it to be true or not.
Once we have established what evidence is, we must evaluate the quality of that evidence and its applicability to a given hypothesis. Each piece of evidence must be evaluated individually in this respect. We must ask questions like "Is this evidence reproducible?", "Is it testable?", and "Is it verifiable?" Much of the alien evidence is none of these things, and those that are have far more rational explanations. As for the mathematical analysis of this data, a collection of small pieces of garbage is a large pile of garbage. To drive this point home, I want you to consider this point very carefully:
Why are you willing to accept the unverifiable claims of visitation based on the sheer numbers of claims, yet equally unwilling to accept the unverifiable claims of being touched by god by an even larger number of witnesses?
Take more than just a few minutes to think about that.
My last point is this: Is your Ancient Aliens Theory or hypothesis even a valid theory or hypothesis in the first place? There are several criteria for a theory to be scientific, but one of the most important is that it is falsifiable. In other words, all theories must be capable of being proved wrong. What would prove your theory wrong? I must point out, that your theory suffers from the same problems as the "A God exists theory" in this respect. It is extraordinarily difficult, and in almost all cases impossible, to prove a negative, IE that something does not exist. That alone, makes it not science. That isn't to say that it isn't true, but the theory is too broad and undefined to be applicable to good science. Far better theories in this subject would be more specific. For example, rather than say the overly general idea that aliens visited us in the past, we could say aliens created the pyramids. In the second case, the falsifiability would be the discovery of human construction or evidence for it, etc...Of course, you would still have to provide evidence for it that specifically demonstrated the aliens, otherwise what right would you have to claim that it wasn't something else? Arguments from incredulity(ex. I can't see how man could have done it, so it must be god or aliens) aren't going to cut it
Aliens visiting is an extraordinary claim. It requires extraordinary evidence.
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