The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!

9/8/2015 5:12:42 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
bigd9832 Chicago, IL 62, joined Oct. 2007	Quote from ludlowlowell: Bigd fails to mention that he quotes from a rabidly anti-Christian website. It seems that anyone who doesn't agree with ludlow must be "anti-christian." Yet many of the Christian researchers have said over again that the writings of the early church fathers have been tampered with. The Catholic church is corrupt. Meet singles at DateHookup.dating, we're 100% free! Join now!
9/8/2015 9:09:44 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
tnteacher101 Morristown, TN 65, joined Aug. 2010	Quote from bigd9832: It seems that anyone who doesn't agree with ludlow must be "anti-christian." Yet many of the Christian researchers have said over again that the writings of the early church fathers have been tampered with. The Catholic church is corrupt. Big: Well Low thinks that only people that goes to the RCC church will go to Yahweh's Rest/Paradise. That is a really strange belief in my humble opinion. I don't think too many people believe that. I have never heard Visiting or Louie say that. Steve
9/11/2015 7:54:04 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
Equalizer21 Seattle, WA 52, joined Oct. 2014	Quote from tnteacher101: Big: Well Low thinks that only people that goes to the RCC church will go to Yahweh's Rest/Paradise. That is a really strange belief in my humble opinion. I don't think too many people believe that. I have never heard Visiting or Louie say that. Steve Its called divisions, sectarianism. Its listed in Galatians under the works of the flesh. When ever you see Lud doing this its a big flashing neon sign.....Hi, im ludlow, i walk in my flaesh, join my church, the only true church.
9/11/2015 10:10:54 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	Ordinarily only Catholics can go to Heaven because going to Heaven requires a complete surrender to Christ. Certainly going to some man-made denomination instead of the Church founded by Christ is not a complete surrender! It is not loving God with all our hearts. It is not loving truth, and we know God is truth. The scripture teaches us that the Church is the mystical body of Christ, so to reject the Church is to reject Christ Himself. But if a person is, through no fault of his own, ignorant of the Catholic faith, he could be saved anyway, because God will not punish anyone who doesn't know that he is in the wrong. With information so readily available these days who can truly say they were ignorant of the Catholic faith? All non-Catholics reading this: the Holy Spirit is calling you to the Catholic Church. Listen to Him.
9/11/2015 10:26:44 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
tnteacher101 Morristown, TN 65, joined Aug. 2010	Quote from ludlowlowell: Ordinarily only Catholics can go to Heaven because going to Heaven requires a complete surrender to Christ. Certainly going to some man-made denomination instead of the Church founded by Christ is not a complete surrender! It is not loving God with all our hearts. It is not loving truth, and we know God is truth. The scripture teaches us that the Church is the mystical body of Christ, so to reject the Church is to reject Christ Himself. But if a person is, through no fault of his own, ignorant of the Catholic faith, he could be saved anyway, because God will not punish anyone who doesn't know that he is in the wrong. With information so readily available these days who can truly say they were ignorant of the Catholic faith? All non-Catholics reading this: the Holy Spirit is calling you to the Catholic Church. Listen to Him. Low: The believers of Yahweh that obey His Laws/Torah and Commandments are the true Church. The only way we can love Yahweh with all our heart and to love fellow believers as ourselves is to follow Yahweh's Laws/Torah and Commandments. Nothing else will work and nothing else will get us to Yahweh's Rest/Paradise/Heaven. The only person that taught that there is a lazy man's way of entering into Paradise was the false teachings of Paul's faith and grace only. Moses, the Prophets, Yeshua and the true 12 Apostles certainly did not teach faith and grace only. The Catholic Church follows the teachings of Paul and not the teachings of the Patriarchs of the Bible and for sure not the teachings of Peter. It is more than obvious to me that the tare Paul has beguiled/seduced the Catholic Church, you and lots of other people and the whole bunch of you have fallen for it hook, line and sinker. You need to wake up and start reading the Bible on your own so you will/may be able to break away from the false teachings of the Catholic Church. Steve
9/12/2015 1:00:31 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	So anybody who cranks their car on Saturday goes to Hell?
9/12/2015 3:41:48 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
bigd9832 Chicago, IL 62, joined Oct. 2007	Quote from ludlowlowell: So anybody who cranks their car on Saturday goes to Hell? I don't see how that is possible.
9/12/2015 4:57:30 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	Tnteacher believes in Hell. He believes the Levitical law must be kept in its entirity as a condition for salvation. The Levitical law says starting fires on Saturday is forbidden. Therefore, cranking a car on Saturday means the cranker goes to Hell, according to Tnteacher. Tnteacher does not understand that (1) the Levitical laws applied to the Jews only, not the whole human race, and (2) Jesus abrogated the Levitical law when He said that what goes into a man does not defile him and when He stopped a stoning of an adulteress.
9/12/2015 6:03:58 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
tnteacher101 Morristown, TN 65, joined Aug. 2010	Quote from ludlowlowell: Tnteacher believes in Hell. He believes the Levitical law must be kept in its entirity as a condition for salvation. The Levitical law says starting fires on Saturday is forbidden. Therefore, cranking a car on Saturday means the cranker goes to Hell, according to Tnteacher. Tnteacher does not understand that (1) the Levitical laws applied to the Jews only, not the whole human race, and (2) Jesus abrogated the Levitical law when He said that what goes into a man does not defile him and when He stopped a stoning of an adulteress. Low: I have explained this to you time and time again. You are simply attempting to make it sound like Yahweh's Laws/Torah and Commandments are too complex to follow but this is simply not true. Like I said before "starting the fires as usual on the Sabbath" meant starting the fires for making bricks as when the 12 Tribes made bricks when they were slaves in the Egyptian Captivity. From what you wrote it shows me that you do understand that Yahweh's Seventh Day Sabbath is on Saturday. No where in the Bible does it state that the Seventh Day Sabbath, Yahweh's Day of Rest, was changed to the first day of the week. Low wrote: Jesus abrogated the Levitical law when He said that what goes into a man does not defile him and when He stopped a stoning of an adulteress. Low: You are simply grasping for straws, so to speak, when you say something silly like what you said in the sentence above. If you will notice, when that verse was written, the subject of that saying was "eating with unwashed hands". It had absolutely nothing to do with cleansing the unclean animals or eliminating the Levitical Laws/Torah. It amazes me that you cannot understand it. Steve
9/12/2015 8:32:17 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
bigd9832 Chicago, IL 62, joined Oct. 2007	Quote from ludlowlowell: Tnteacher believes in Hell. He believes the Levitical law must be kept in its entirity as a condition for salvation. Given how much you misquote and misinterpret what I say I would have a hard time believing anything you say about another. I still maintain that anyone who promotes the doctrine of a "hell" has a sick and twisted mine. The Catholic church is corrupt.
9/12/2015 1:27:27 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	Do we see the very, very different interpretations Tnteacher and Bigd have here, each believing in, and quoting from the Bible? Do we see thousands and thousands of Protestant denominations, each pointing to the Bible, each with different interpretations? Sometimes someone like Tnt will say of someone like Bigd, oh, he has faulty interpretations because he doesn't read the Bible, and sometimes someone like Bigd will say the same of someone like Tnt. The truth is both read the Bible voraciously, but come up with different interpretations. Down South here the two main religions are Baptist and Pentecostal (Tnt will attest to that, I'm sure). So many times I have heard them argue. The Baptists say the Pentecostals don't agree with them because, "Those Pentecostals just don't read the Bible," and vice versa. The reality is that they both read the Bible! They just have different interpretations. Jesus knew this would happen. That's one reason He established the authoritative infallible Church, to teach the people what tge scriptures really mean. It takes humility to let go of one's own opinions and submit to the teachings of the Church, but God made it clear that only the humble go to Heaven. See Matthew 11:29 and Luke 1:51. [Edited 9/12/2015 1:29:56 PM ]
9/12/2015 1:55:17 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 75, joined Apr. 2011 online now!	Quote from ludlowlowell: Jesus said that His Flesh was real food and His Blood real drink. Thay is not symbolic talk. As I told you before the disciples did not understand what he was saying and if indeed when they ate the bread and drank the wine they ate and tasted actual flesh and blood they would certainly have been AGHAST just as you would in your Eucharist if you did also. It is utter foolishness to think you can partake of the divine presence of God/Jesus and gain eternal life by becoming a cannibal and eating his flesh and drinking his blood, Ludlow. You are a foolish man and a liar, Ludlow, and it is evident that your practice of the Eucharist has done nothing for you.
9/12/2015 4:43:02 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
prophetic774 Winter Haven, FL 64, joined Feb. 2011	THE AMAZING PROPHECY OF ST MALACHY IN AD 1139 THAT THERE WILL BE 112 POPES AFTER AD 1139 AND THAT DURING THE REIGN OF THE 112TH POPE THE END OF THE WORLD WILL COME. POPE FRANCIS IS THE 112TH POPE!! St. Malachy was the Archbishop of Armagh, Ireland. He claimed he experienced a vision while visiting Rome in 1139 AD. He said he saw every pope that would exist from the time of his vision until the last pope. The last pope would be the 112th from the time of his vision. Malachy also stated that the last pope would be a very evil pope and that God would judge His people and the city of Rome would be destroyed during the reign of this last pope. On February 11, 2013, Pope Benedict shocked the world by announcing his intention to resign from the papacy. This was the first resignation of a pope while in office in over 600 years. Benedict said that, at the age of 85, he no longer had the strength to execute the duties of leading the Roman Catholic Church. It was time to elect the 112th pope foretold in the vision of St. Malachy! Overlooking St. Peter’s Square, the announcement was made that Cardinal Jorge Mario Bergoglio of Argentina had been elected the 112th pope in the prophecy on March 13th, 2013!! The Satanic Pope Francis is the leader of about 1,000,000,000 {One Billion} Roman Catholics and it is quite obvious that he is evil and Satanic and would therefore agree with the future False Prophet of 666!! There are many reasons to believe that Barack Hussein Obama qualifies to be the future False Prophet of 666 and it is quite amazing in how many ways the 112th and last pope agrees with Obama!! POPE FRANCIS AGREES WITH OBAMA ON ALMOST EVERYTHING!! A Roman Catholic Priest Says Homosexuality Is Gift From God, And That The Bible Is Not The Word Of God, And Then Pope Francis Kisses His Hand And Praises Him?? A 93 year old Italian priest named Michele de Paolis, considered to be Italy’s most rebellious priest and amongst the most universally notorious advocates for the Catholic Church to change its position on homosexuality, said:? homosexual love is a gift from (God) no less than heterosexual. This same damned heretic said: ? The Bible “is” not the word of God And now, just a few days ago, Francis, whether by his own will or through some malicious advisors, celebrated mass with this evil man and then kissed his hand??? Pope Francis: says, The Church could support civil unions??? By Daniel Burke, CNN Belief Blog Co-Editor (CNN) - Pope Francis suggested in a newspaper interview that it could support some types of civil unions. A number of Catholic bishops have supported civil unions for same-sex couples, including Pope Francis when he was Archbishop of Buenos Aires in 2010, according to reports in National Catholic Reporter and The New York Times. Behind closed doors, pope supported civil unions in Argentina, activist says. But Wednesday's comments are "the first time a Pope has indicated even tentative acceptance of civil unions," according to Catholic News Service. Francis delivers homilies each day, the contents of which are summarized by Vatican Radio. On May 22, he caused no shortage of confusion when he suggested that even atheists could find salvation. Obama who may be the future False Prophet of 666 has said the exact same thing!!! In his homily, Francis said: "The Lord has redeemed all of us, all of us, with the Blood of Christ: all of us, not just Catholics. Everyone! 'Father, the atheists?' Even the atheists. Everyone!" However Jesus says, "No one can come to the Father except through Me." Pope Francis also says "Who am I to judge homosexuals." and Pope Francis states that sincere homosexuals will also enter the kingdom of heaven just like Obama. But what does God's Word say?? See I Corinthians 6:9-11: Responding to a list of questions published in the paper by Mr Scalfari, who is not a Roman Catholic, Francis wrote: “You ask me if the God of the Christians forgives those who don’t believe and who don’t seek the faith. I start by saying – and this is the fundamental thing – that God’s mercy has no limits if you go to him with a sincere and contrite heart. The issue for those who do not believe in God is to obey their conscience. “Sin, even for those who have no faith, exists when people disobey their conscience.”???? Pope Francis totally agrees with Obama and believes that all who do not believe in Global Warming are sinning and everyone who does not do something to reduce global warming is sinning. And so it is interesting to note that the 112th and last pope {??} who is the leader of about 1,000,000,000 {One Billion} Roman Catholics agrees with the possible future False Prophet of 666 on almost everything!! Pope Francis will visit with Obama and address the united Nations on his 5-day trip to the USA from September 22nd to 8PM on September 27th, 2015. The Pope will end his trip in Philadelphia and will depart for the Vatican at 8PM on September 27th, 2015. Sundown in Philadelphia will be at 6:49 PM on September 27th, 2015. The Blood Red Moon elcipse will begin 11 minutes after the Pope's departure at 8:11 PM in Philadelphia and will end at 1::22 AM on September 28th {As per: timeanddate.com/eclipse/in/Philadelphia} And so the Pope will leave the USA {11 minutes} after sundown and the 4th Blood Red Moon eclipse will also begin {11 minutes} after the Pope's departure. It is interesting to note that 11 minutes plus 6 seconds is exactly 666 seconds {10 times 60 seconds is 600 seconds plus 66 seconds is exactly (666} seconds!! And so the 4th Blood Red Moon eclipse will last 5 hours and 11 minutes and possibly 6 seconds which would be after {666} seconds of the {6th} hour. September 29th, 2015 is the {7th} anniversary of September 29th, 2008 when the USA stock market dropped {7 Percent} which was exactly {777} points!! The founder of Trends Research, who predicted the "panic of 2008," believes that soon we will witness the crash of a global stock market and predicts "the economic earthquake that will send reverberations around the world". "There's going to be panic on the streets from Wall Street to Shanghai, to the UK down to Brazil." Celente told King World News. "You're going to see one market after another begin to collapse." The whole world will be looking for a Savior and 666 and his False Propohet may fill that need???!!! Matthew 24:9,10,13,29-31: Jesus says, "Then {During the 1260-day Great Tribulation} you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of Me. At that time many will turn away from from the faith and will betray and hate each other... but he who stands firm to the end will be saved...Immediately after the distress of those {1260} days the sun will be darkened and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from the sky...At that time the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and everyone will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of the sky with power and great glory. And He will send His angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather His elect!"
9/12/2015 8:22:16 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
tnteacher101 Morristown, TN 65, joined Aug. 2010	Quote from kb2222: Quote from ludlowlowell: Jesus said that His Flesh was real food and His Blood real drink. Thay is not symbolic talk. As I told you before the disciples did not understand what he was saying and if indeed when they ate the bread and drank the wine they ate and tasted actual flesh and blood they would certainly have been AGHAST just as you would in your Eucharist if you did also. It is utter foolishness to think you can partake of the divine presence of God/Jesus and gain eternal life by becoming a cannibal and eating his flesh and drinking his blood, Ludlow. You are a foolish man and a liar, Ludlow, and it is evident that your practice of the Eucharist has done nothing for you. KB: I will say that I agree with your above statement about the Transubstantiation except I would never, ever, say Low is foolish. I think Low it attempting to understand the Bible but he has just been mislead to a major extent by the Catholic Church. I think if Low would read the Bible on his own he would understand it much better than he does now. Low: Are you hearing me telling you that you need to read the Bible for yourself? Steve
9/12/2015 9:28:54 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
prophetic774 Winter Haven, FL 64, joined Feb. 2011	WE ARE ALL WAITING FOR THE NEW EARTH, THE NEW HEAVENS AND THE HEAVENLY NEW JERUSALEM!! Revelation 21:1-5: Then I saw a New heaven and a New Earth, for the {present} first heaven and first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea. I saw the Holy City, the NEW JERUSALEM, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, "Now the dwelling of God is with men, and He will live with them. They will be His people, and God Himself will be with them. They will be His people, and God Himself will be with them and be their God. He will wipe every tear from their eyes, There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away." He who was seated on the throne said, "I am making EVERYTHING NEW!" Then He said, "Write this down, for these words are TRUSTWORTHY and TRUE!" 2 Peter 3:10-13: But the Day of the Lord will come like a thief. The heavens will DISAPPEAR with a roar; the elements will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and EVERYTHING in it will be burned up {NIV}. Since everything will be destroyed in this way, what kind what kind of people ought you to be? You ought to live holy and godly lives as you wait eagerly for the Day of God to come. {NIV} That Day will bring about the destruction of the heavens by fire, and the elements will melt in the heat. But in keeping with His promise WE {Excluding the Preterists and the RC church} are looking forward to a New heavens and a New Earth, the home of righteousness. Hebrews 11:13-16: All these people {Abraham, Sarah Isaac, Jacob, Noah etc} were still living by faith when they died. They did not receive the things promised; they only saw them from a distance. And they admitted that they were aliens and strangers on earth. People who say such things show they are looking for a country of their own. If they had been thinking of the country they had left, they would have had opportunity to return. Instead, they were looking for a BETTER COUNTRY--a HEAVENLY ONE. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for he has prepared a CITY (The NEW JERUSALEM} for them!! Galatians 4:25,26: Now Hagar stands for Mount Sinai in Arabia and corresponds to the present city of Jerusalem, because she is in slavery with her children. But the JERUSALEM that is ABOVE is free, and she is our MOTHER !! Revelation 22:16,18,19: "I, Jesus, have sent My angel to give you this testimony for the churches.....I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this Book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book {Including eternal hell}. And if anyone takes WORDS AWAY {Like the Preterists and the RC church} from this book of prophecy, God will take away his share in the Tree of Life and in the Holy City {The NEW JERUSALEM}, which are described in this Book.!!" The New Jerusalem is described in Revelation 21:9 to Revelation 22:5. The New Jerusalem will be 12,000 stadia {which is about 1377 miles} long, high and wide as per Revelation 21:16. A stadia is 606 feet long which is the exact same length as the ancient Greek stadium. 606 feet times 12,000 equals 7,272,000 feet which is 1377 miles plus 1,440 feet. A mile is exactly 5,280 feet. {1377 times 5,280 feet equal 7,270,560 feet.} And so the New Jerusalem will be exactly 1377 miles plus 1,440 feet long, wide and high!! Revelation 21:9-12,15-16,19,23,27: The angel said to John, “Come, I will show you the Bride the Wife of the Lamb.” And he carried me away in the Spirit to a mountain great and high, and showed me the Holy City, Jerusalem, coming down out of Heaven from from God It shone like the glory of God, and its brilliance was like that of a very precious jewel. It had a great high wall {1377 miles plus 1,440 feet HIGH!} with 12 gates, and with 12 angels at the gates. The angel who talked with me had a measuring rod of gold to measure the City, its gates and its walls. The City was laid out like a square, as long as it was wide. He measured the City with the rod and found it to be 12,000 stadia {A Stadia is exactly 606 feet} in length, and as wide and high as it is long. {1377 miles plus 1,440 feet long, wide and high} The wall was made of Jasper, and the City of pure gold, as pure as glass. The foundations of the city walls were decorated with every kind of precious stone....... The great street of the City was of pure gold, like transparent glass...... Only those written in the Lamb's Book of Life will be able to enter the New Jerusalem! Revelation 22:1-6: Then the angel showed me the river of the Water of Life, as clear as crystal, flowing from the throne of God and the Lamb {Jesus} down the middle of the great street of the City. On each side of the river stood the Tree of Life, bearing 12 crops of fruit, yielding its fruit every month... The throne of God and of the Lamb will be in the City, and his servants will serve Him. They will see His face and His name will be on their foreheads. There will be no more night!! They will not need the light of the lamp or the light of the sun, for the Lord God will give them light. And they will reign for ever and ever. The angel said to me, “These words are TRUSTWORTHY and TRUE!!” JESUS WILL WRITE ON US THE NAME OF THE CITY OF GOD THE NEW JERUSALEM!! Revelation 2:18; 3:12,21: Jesus says, "To him who overcomes I will give him a white stone with a new name written on it, known only to him who receives it...And I will make a pillar in the temple of my God. Never again will he leave it. I will write on him the name of the City of My God, the NEW JERUSALEM, which is coming down out of heaven from My God....And I will give the right to sit with Me on My throne, just as I overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne." {According to Revelation 22:3 the only 2 thrones in the New Jerusalem will be the thrones of the Father and of the Lamb Jesus Christ.}
9/13/2015 3:43:37 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
bigd9832 Chicago, IL 62, joined Oct. 2007	I have to say that I agree with steve on this one. You need to read the bible for yourself. The Catholic church is corrupt.
9/13/2015 5:23:41 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	Protestants have opinions. Catholics have answers that they are absolutely positive about. Protestantism, the shifting sands. Catholicism, the solid rock.
9/13/2015 5:54:54 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
bigd9832 Chicago, IL 62, joined Oct. 2007	Catholics have fantasies. The Catholic church is corrupt.
9/13/2015 8:37:24 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
tnteacher101 Morristown, TN 65, joined Aug. 2010	Quote from ludlowlowell: Protestants have opinions. Catholics have answers that they are absolutely positive about. Protestantism, the shifting sands. Catholicism, the solid rock. 2 Timothy 2:15 King James Bible Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. Low: This verse tells you what you must do. Paul did a very good job of explaining that you must read the Bible on your own. First hand information is always better than second hand information. When you read the Bible on your own then you are getting first hand information. When your Catholic Church tells you what the Bible says then that is second hand information. Over the years I have found that reading the Bible is very important. Yahweh will speak to you and reveal truths to you that you would not have received if you had not read the Bible on your own. Steve
9/13/2015 10:11:26 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	It's the other way around. The Church's teaching is first hand and the Bible is second hand. The Church existed three and a half centuries before there was such a thing as a Bible. Also, until 1450, when they invented the printing press, very few Christians owned their own Bible.
9/13/2015 11:37:49 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
Equalizer21 Seattle, WA 52, joined Oct. 2014	Quote from ludlowlowell: It's the other way around. The Church's teaching is first hand and the Bible is second hand. The Church existed three and a half centuries before there was such a thing as a Bible. Also, until 1450, when they invented the printing press, very few Christians owned their own Bible. What was put in the bible was recorded and around before you say your denomination started!
9/14/2015 12:33:11 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	The Old Testament was, but not the New Testament. Jesus founded the Church circa 33 a.d., and the earliest books of the New Testament were written 20 to 30 years later. And it wasn't until 393 a.d., about 350 years later, that the books of tge Bible were all compiled into the Bible.
9/14/2015 2:30:33 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
share_n_love Fort Wayne, IN 60, joined Dec. 2012	Nope Lud!
9/14/2015 6:13:18 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
bigd9832 Chicago, IL 62, joined Oct. 2007	First we have to establish what the "church" is. It is certainly NOT the Catholic church. The word "catholic" is not even in the bible. Jesus' church has no name and no denomination. All the people who were taught by Jesus are all gone. No one is alive from that time to teach us or lead His church. Information an be handed down from generation to generation but, like I said in my... The Telephone Game https://DateHookup.dating/Thread-1430315.htm I show how this information can degrade. Thank God we have the INSPIRED writings of that era (aka the Bible) and His Living Presence to guide us. The Catholic church is corrupt.
9/14/2015 7:31:37 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	Share and Bigd, you guys need to read some history.
9/14/2015 11:19:33 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
bigd9832 Chicago, IL 62, joined Oct. 2007	I can't speak for anyone else, But I know I sure have. And much of the history I have studied does not agree with what you say here. But then, you are a cab driver, not a rocket scientist. The Catholic church is corrupt.
9/14/2015 4:36:43 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	If you really want to learn history, read tge writings of tge Fathers of the Church. Also, read tge story of John Henry Newman, an Anglican clergyman who, after studying the early Christian Church, became a Catholic.
9/14/2015 7:44:44 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
tnteacher101 Morristown, TN 65, joined Aug. 2010	Quote from ludlowlowell: The Old Testament was, but not the New Testament. Jesus founded the Church circa 33 a.d., and the earliest books of the New Testament were written 20 to 30 years later. And it wasn't until 393 a.d., about 350 years later, that the books of tge Bible were all compiled into the Bible. Low: The First Council of Nicaea was in 325 AD when Constantine hired 300 Church leaders to compile the first New Testament Bible. Constantine had 50 of these Bibles hand copied and had them distributed to the churches his kingdom. Some of these church leaders favored the teachings of Paul and some did not. Of course everyone knows that the ones that favored Paul's strange letters won out since there are 14 letters/books that Paul wrote in the New Testament. These individual books and many other writings/books that were not eventually included in the New Testament had been used by the churches for quite some time but in the First Council of Nicaea resulted in the first time these Books were compiled into one Book/Bible. As everyone knows what is now called the Old Testament was the only Bible that was available until the New Testament was added in 325 AD. We need to keep in mind that the people that decided on what books would go into the New Testament were subject to making mistakes like all human beings. What we now call the Old Testment was what Yeshua used and what the churches used and read and I am sure it can be trusted to tell us the truth of Yahweh's Word. The New Testament we have now is relatively new compared to the Old Testament and more than likely is not as faultless as the Old Testament. As I have mentioned many times before, I question many of the writings of the New Testament and lots of what Paul wrote in the New Testament is contradictory. Paul does a lot of stuttering and speaking out of both sides of his mouth, so to speak, and to me and I am sure to lots of others that diminshes the infallibility of the New Testament to some degree/extent. When Yeshua is the King on this Earth for 1,000 years I am more than sure that He will teach us the complete truth of Yahweh's Word. Yeshua was born to be a King but when He was on the Cross He plainly said His Kingdom had not get come/arrived. I am sure everyone is looking forward to Yeshua's Reign as King on this Earth. Steve
9/14/2015 8:35:23 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	You've got a lot of the facts wrong, Tnt. The canon (list of books that should go into the Bible) was not discussed at Nicea. Not at all. And if any Christian bishop taught that Paul's writings were heretical I have never heard of them. Could you make a list of early bishops opposed to Paul's teachings? Since none of Constantine's Bibles are extant we don't know what was in it. Some scholars think that it was not a Bible at all but a lectionary (a book containing the prayers of the Mass). The reality is that the canon of scripture was decided at the Council of Hippo in the year 393 a.d., 56 years after Constantine's death.
9/14/2015 9:56:39 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
tnteacher101 Morristown, TN 65, joined Aug. 2010	Quote from ludlowlowell: You've got a lot of the facts wrong, Tnt. The canon (list of books that should go into the Bible) was not discussed at Nicea. Not at all. And if any Christian bishop taught that Paul's writings were heretical I have never heard of them. Could you make a list of early bishops opposed to Paul's teachings? Since none of Constantine's Bibles are extant we don't know what was in it. Some scholars think that it was not a Bible at all but a lectionary (a book containing the prayers of the Mass). The reality is that the canon of scripture was decided at the Council of Hippo in the year 393 a.d., 56 years after Constantine's death. Low: Constantine hired 300 church leaders to help him come up with a New Testament that he would make 50 copies of and distribute to the churches that were located in the area he ruled. Would you tell me what was the reason he would hire three hundred church leaders to do if they were not attempting to agree on what Books/Letters would go into that Bible? I don't know of any list of the 300 church leaders that Constantine hired to do this work. If you think that you know the names of those 300 church leaders then would you post their names for everyone to see? How do you know the Books/Letters of the Bible were determined in 393? How do you know that the Books/Letters that went into the Bible were not determined in The Council of Nicaea in 325 AD. Steve
9/14/2015 11:43:35 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	1. Where is your evidence that Constantine "hired" the bishops gathered at Nicea? Yes, Constantine called the council but he did not hire the bishops. 2. The Council of Nicea concerned itself with the divinity of Christ and the Arian heresy. The canon was not discussed. 3. Even if it was the Council of Nicea rather than the Council of Hippo that put the Bible together, it was still a council of Catholic bishops.
9/15/2015 9:36:53 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
tnteacher101 Morristown, TN 65, joined Aug. 2010	Quote from ludlowlowell: 1. Where is your evidence that Constantine "hired" the bishops gathered at Nicea? Yes, Constantine called the council but he did not hire the bishops. Constantine not only called the 300 or so church leaders but paid for their travel to and from the Council of Nicaea, provided their food and lodging and elaborate meeting place. In other words Constantine was in charge of the Council of Nicaea. Quote from ludlowlowell: 2. The Council of Nicea concerned itself with the divinity of Christ and the Arian heresy. The canon was not discussed. Low: This suggests that Cannon was discussed at the Council of Nicaea: In tracing the origin of the Bible, one is led to AD 325, when > Constantine the Great called the First Council of Nicaea, composed of > 300 religious leaders. Three centuries after Jesus lived, this council > was given the task of separating divinely inspired writings from those > of questionable origin. > The actual compilation of the Bible was an incredibly complicated > project that involved churchmen of many varying beliefs, in an > atmosphere of dissension, jealousy, intolerance, persecution and > bigotry. > At this time, the question of the divinity of Jesus had split the > church into two factions. Constantine offered to make the little-known > Christian sect the official state religion if the Christians would > settle their differences. Apparently, he didn't particularly care what > they believed in as long as they agreed upon a belief. By compiling a > book of sacred writings, Constantine thought that the book would give > authority to the new church. > Also, we do know that there were many books of supposed prophets > floating around up until 312 CE when the Council of Nicea decided > which books were scripture and which ones were burned. Thanks to > the notorious habit of early Christian leaders of destroying > books/scrolls, we may never know what doctrine existed before the > Council of Nicea. >Actually, legend has it that at the Council of Nicea, Constantine was >unsure of what else to include as a holy scripture (which later the batch >became the Bible). He threw the batch that he was to choose from onto a >table. Those that remained on the table were in, those that fell off were >out. Source: http://www.tertullian.org/rpearse/nicaea.html In Jerome's Prologue to Judith[68] he claims that the Book of Judith was "found by the Nicene Council to have been counted among the number of the Sacred Scriptures", which suggests that the Nicene Council did discuss what documents would number among the sacred scriptures. Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Council_of_Nicaea Quote from ludlowlowell: 3. Even if it was the Council of Nicea rather than the Council of Hippo that put the Bible together, it was still a council of Catholic bishops. It appears from the text below that the Pagan Constantine was the very one that pushed the teachings of Paul Letters into the Bible and single handedly eliminated the Mosaic Code making swine's flesh permissible to eat. You may or may not be interested in reading this: Christianity consisted of many sects. By converting Constantine > (The Great) the Paul heresy triumphed as the concept of trinity and the ending of the > Mosaic law (which made swine flesh permissible) brought this version of > Christianity very close to the Hellenic paganism that was practiced in Rome > and Greece. At Nicea Constantine had 300 versions of the Bible burnt, thus > legitimising and patronizing only the Paulic heresy. Source of the above: http://www.tertullian.org/rpearse/nicaea.html Steve [Edited 9/15/2015 9:37:55 AM ]
9/15/2015 1:26:42 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	I am a history buff and in my 62 years (45 of them as a Catholic believer) I have read a lot of history bout the early Christians, and I can tell you that the "facts" presented from that website you quoted are as bogus as theycould be. The canon of scripture simply was not discussed at Nicea. Period. The canon was decided---by the Catholic bishops---at Hippo, not Nicea, 68 years after Nicea, 56 years after Constantine's death. That Bible that Protestants love to quote from? It is a Catholic book.
9/15/2015 3:24:34 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
tnteacher101 Morristown, TN 65, joined Aug. 2010	Quote from ludlowlowell: I am a history buff and in my 62 years (45 of them as a Catholic believer) I have read a lot of history bout the early Christians, and I can tell you that the "facts" presented from that website you quoted are as bogus as theycould be. The canon of scripture simply was not discussed at Nicea. Period. The canon was decided---by the Catholic bishops---at Hippo, not Nicea, 68 years after Nicea, 56 years after Constantine's death. That Bible that Protestants love to quote from? It is a Catholic book. Low: Have you ever thought the Catholic Church History Lessons you have been reading could have been somewhat slanted toward what the RCC wanted you to believe instead of the actual facts of the matter/situation. If you are not cautious the RCC may try to lead you around with a chain tied around either your neck or waist or possibly both. I am sure most religious organizations would do the same thing if they thought they could get away with it. Steve
9/15/2015 5:34:09 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	Read the history, Tnt. History is not Catholic or Protestant, history is history. Let's suppose for a moment that you are right, and the Council of Nicea fixed the canon, not the Council of Hippo. Either way the Catholic Church set the canon. Either way the Church determined which books went in the Bible and which ones not. Either way the Church is the mother of the Bible, not the other way around. Either way, believing in the Bible while rejecting the Catholic Church would be like believing in the Boy Scout Handbook while rejecting the Boy Scouts. "To be deep in history is to cease to be Protestant." --Cardinal John Henry Newman John Henry Newman is a man you might want to read up on. He was an Anglican cletgyman in the 1800s, a scholar who had, among other things, done extensive research on the Arian heresy of the fourth century. The more he studied the early Church the more he saw how completely Catholic it was, and he became a Catholic in 1845 at the age of 45. Since he had never married he decided to go to Catholic seminary, and after he finished his studies he became a priest, and later bishop and cardinal. The Church is considering declaring him to be a saint. [Edited 9/15/2015 5:35:34 PM ]
9/15/2015 6:17:40 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
looptex1 Chatsworth, GA 47, joined Jun. 2008 online now!	Quote from ludlowlowell: Either way, believing in the Bible while rejecting the Catholic Church would be like believing in the Boy Scout Handbook while rejecting the Boy Scouts. . just a small bit or information. the boy scouts wrote their handbook. they did not take other peoples writings and bind them together. the catholic church took other peoples writings and bound them together. they did not write them.
9/15/2015 6:53:11 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
tnteacher101 Morristown, TN 65, joined Aug. 2010	Low wrote: Read the history, Tnt. History is not Catholic or Protestant, history is history. Low: I know very well how history can be manipulated. I grew up thinking Christopher Columbus was someone special. I learned later he was a murdering, heaten madman. It is obvious to me and most everyone else on this site that the RCC has you in their grip and I am sure they don't plan to let you escape their strong hold on you. You appear to be at the point that you cannot think for yourself. It also appears that you worship the RCC instead of Yahweh. The RCC breaks most of Yahweh's Ten Commandments on a regular basis. We must be cautious about having false gods. Steve
9/15/2015 8:30:33 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	Seek the truth, Tnt. That's all I can say.
9/16/2015 7:29:15 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
tnteacher101 Morristown, TN 65, joined Aug. 2010	Quote from ludlowlowell: Seek the truth, Tnt. That's all I can say. Low: We all should seek the truth of Yahweh's Word daily. The Bible is written in such a way that only Yahweh can reveal his Blessed Truths to us. The devil and his demons attempt to blind us to the point that we cannot understand those Blessed Truths but we must pray that Yahweh will protect us and keep us far from the evil one and his servants. Steve
9/16/2015 8:30:29 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	But you don't believe in the Bible! You don't believe in Paul's epistles. You don't believe in II Peter bevause it endorses Paul's message. You don't believe in Luke or Acts because they were written by Luke, Paul's friend, and because you don't believe Paul's conversion story as related by Acts.
9/16/2015 10:32:58 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
tnteacher101 Morristown, TN 65, joined Aug. 2010	Quote from ludlowlowell: But you don't believe in the Bible! You don't believe in Paul's epistles. You don't believe in II Peter bevause it endorses Paul's message. You don't believe in Luke or Acts because they were written by Luke, Paul's friend, and because you don't believe Paul's conversion story as related by Acts. Low: I am sure you know very well what I think about some of the silly and strange teachings of Paul. When Paul's teachings disagrees with the teachings of Moses, the Prophets, Yeshua or the true 12 Apostles then I ignore what Paul says and believe what those Patriarchs's teach. Paul was not a good role model for us since he was a murderer, tare and false Apostle. Steve
9/16/2015 12:11:18 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	Paul was a converted sinner. That's one of the main points---sinners can convert and change their ways. Tnt, you believe in scripture...until it disagrees with you, then you say, oh, the guy who wrote [whatever book you disagree with] was a murderer and a tare."
9/16/2015 3:26:16 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
tnteacher101 Morristown, TN 65, joined Aug. 2010	Quote from ludlowlowell: Paul was a converted sinner. That's one of the main points---sinners can convert and change their ways. Tnt, you believe in scripture...until it disagrees with you, then you say, oh, the guy who wrote [whatever book you disagree with] was a murderer and a tare." Low: I believe in scripture until it disagrees with the teachings of Moses, the Prophets, Yeshua and the true 12 Apostles then I assume the person that disagrees with the Patriarchs of the Bible are incorrect. Steve
9/16/2015 6:44:18 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	Coyld it be that Paul was right and Moses wrong? (I don't believe that myself---just throwing it out for discussion.) Why does Moses outrank Paul? Doesn't the New Testament outrank the Ild?
9/17/2015 9:25:24 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
tnteacher101 Morristown, TN 65, joined Aug. 2010	Quote from ludlowlowell: Coyld it be that Paul was right and Moses wrong? (I don't believe that myself---just throwing it out for discussion.) Why does Moses outrank Paul? Doesn't the New Testament outrank the Ild? Low: If Moses was wrong and silly Paul was correct then the Old Testament needs to be discarded and the Old Testament has been more or less discarded in most of the churches in our country today. Very few churches/ministers quote the Old Testament these days and their favorite person to quote are the strange teachings of Paul. I know very well that most people today follow the teachings of Paul over the teachings of Moses, the Prophets, Yeshua and the true 12 Apostles and there is the root of the problems the churches are having. The Old testament was the only Bible that was available when Yeshua was on this Earth and Jeshua never, ever, said there were any problems with it. Then along comes Paul and throws out most all of the teachings of the Old Testament and comes up with a totally different set of guidelines that opposes the teachings of the true Patriarchs of the Bible. Paul taught that the fuzzy feeling of faith and grace was all that was necessary and discarded juat about all other teachings. No where in the Bible did Yeshua or the true Twleve Apostles say all we needed was faith and grace. All people today that call themselves Christians are really followers of Paul and should be called Paulinians. It appears that the God of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and the Twelve Tribes of Jacob has been discarded and the god Paul is the one most people worship today. Paul used the word "I" more than any other writer in the Bible. Paul's favorite subject was Paul. Very little of what Paul wrote and taught agreed with the teachings of Peter and the Catholic Church seems to follow all the teachings of Paul and none of the teachings of Paul. Steve
9/18/2015 5:07:13 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
share_n_love Fort Wayne, IN 60, joined Dec. 2012	Lud, you say Peter is your first Pope. Then how can the wine turn into Yahshua's blood and you consume it when Peter said this in acts 15:20: 20. Instead, we should write them a letter telling them to abstain from things polluted by idols, from fornication, from what is strangled and from blood. Gentiles as well Israelites are NOT to consume blood.
9/18/2015 7:17:12 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	The blood of animals was forbidden, not the Blood of Christ.
9/18/2015 7:20:56 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
looptex1 Chatsworth, GA 47, joined Jun. 2008 online now!	Quote from share_n_love: Lud, you say Peter is your first Pope. Then how can the wine turn into Yahshua's blood and you consume it when Peter said this in acts 15:20: 20. Instead, we should write them a letter telling them to abstain from things polluted by idols, from fornication, from what is strangled and from blood. Gentiles as well Israelites are NOT to consume blood. oh, me,me,me,me!!! could it have anything to do with the words christ said, just after he spoke of his blood and his flesh? my words are spirit,my words are life
9/18/2015 9:59:06 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	If Jesus were only a pure spirit He woyld not have been a man, would He? He wouldn't have been able to suffer and die on the cross if He were merely a spirit. Jesus is God but He is also a flesh-and-blood man and He assures us at John 6:55 that His Body is real food and His Blood real drink. I was able to make it to daily Mass this morning. The former pastor, now in retirement, said Mass, the current pastor being on vacation in Poland. What beautiful and wonderful things Mass and Communion are.
9/18/2015 10:01:56 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
looptex1 Chatsworth, GA 47, joined Jun. 2008 online now!	Quote from ludlowlowell: If Jesus were only a pure spirit He woyld not have been a man, would He? He wouldn't have been able to suffer and die on the cross if He were merely a spirit. Jesus is God but He is also a flesh-and-blood man and He assures us at John 6:55 that His Body is real food and His Blood real drink. I was able to make it to daily Mass this morning. The former pastor, now in retirement, said Mass, the current pastor being on vacation in Poland. What beautiful and wonderful things Mass and Communion are. he also made it clear, he was the light..yet he didnt glow jn the dark
9/18/2015 11:18:12 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	Since Jesus is the light of the world the Church He founded, the Catholic Church must also be the light of the world. I believe in Jesus Christ. That's why I am a Catholic.
9/18/2015 11:28:20 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
looptex1 Chatsworth, GA 47, joined Jun. 2008 online now!	Quote from ludlowlowell: Since Jesus is the light of the world the Church He founded, the Catholic Church must also be the light of the world. I believe in Jesus Christ. That's why I am a Catholic. yep, but you would do well to become a christian.
9/18/2015 11:48:16 AM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	I believe in Jesus Christ. That's why I am a Catholic.
9/18/2015 2:03:06 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
share_n_love Fort Wayne, IN 60, joined Dec. 2012	Quote from ludlowlowell: The blood of animals was forbidden, not the Blood of Christ. Peter isn't clarifying the description just as God didn't when He laid out the same command in the Tanakh/OT...it says BLOOD. So as with all the examples in God's word when it isn't clarified it MEANS ALL blood. YOU are clarifying it and therefore telling the world something totally against God's word.
9/18/2015 2:48:23 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	I didn't clarify it, the Catholic Church clarified it centuries ago. "Lean not to your own understanding." --Proverbs 3:5
9/18/2015 3:03:00 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
bigd9832 Chicago, IL 62, joined Oct. 2007	Quote from ludlowlowell: I believe in Jesus Christ. That's why I am a Catholic. But you have traded in Jesus Christ for a church. The Catholic church is corrupt.
9/18/2015 8:12:49 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
share_n_love Fort Wayne, IN 60, joined Dec. 2012	Then THEY are telling the world something that is against the word of God, and you believe it. So you better be careful what you what you are sharing with the world. [Edited 9/18/2015 8:13:42 PM ]
9/18/2015 9:48:11 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	The Catholic Church is beautiful and wonderful.
9/18/2015 10:16:38 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
tnteacher101 Morristown, TN 65, joined Aug. 2010	Quote from share_n_love: Then THEY are telling the world something that is against the word of God, and you believe it. So you better be careful what you what you are sharing with the world. Low: It is more than obvious that what Share says makes perfect sense and what you are saying about eating Christ's Flesh and Blood makes no sense at all. In the Old Testament and the New Testament it always says to not eat the fat or the blood of anything. When Yeshus said to eat His Flesh and Blood it was symbolism. I know the Catholic Church teaches this strange doctrine but only 24% say they believe it so that makes 76% of the RCC Church that totally disagrees with it. It would be my guess that those 24% of the ones that said they believed the bread and wine turned into the Flesh and Blood of Christ said they believed it just to go along with the teachings of their church. I would doubt that even 10% of the Catholics actually believe it. Like Share said you need to be cautious not to teach false doctrine. Steve
9/18/2015 10:42:54 PM	The Doctrine of Transubstantiation is False!
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 62, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	Jesus did not say, "This is a symbol of my body". He said, "This IS my body", and He said It was real food and drink. You're passing up an incredible Treasure, Tnteacher.

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