Maybe we should get some fire insurance.

2/15/2016 11:50:43 AM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 63, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	Supposing---just supposing now---those crazy old Christians are right, and Jesus Christ really is the Incarnate Son of God and the Savior of the world, and just supposing---hey, call it supposing for laughs and grins---all non-believers in Jesus will be sent to burn in Hell forever. Why not believe in Jesus, just as a form of fire insurance? We shell out good money to make sure we are reumbursed if our houses burn down. Why not a little insurance for the soul? And what does it cost? Nothing! Unlike State Farm, Geico, and Progressive, there are no premiums to pay. True, we have to give up our sins, but our sins oppress us, don't they, even in this life. And true, we have to love God above all else, but that's eady to do because God is so lovable. Everything to gain, nothing to lose. What people these days call a win-win situation. Meet singles at DateHookup.dating, we're 100% free! Join now!
2/15/2016 11:58:57 AM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
clarence2 South Yorkshire United Kingdom 58, joined May. 2011	You're right, it's a good selling point for the Abrahamic God that he threatens to hurt people who don't believe in him and represents a ploy that's sure to persuade many weak minded individuals or folks who have grown up indoctrinated with a fear of hell. More rational people though will tend to think a god who coerces with threats is no more likely to exist than harmless gods who don't threaten. Those folks will most likely continue to happily worship their own gods or will remain atheistic or agnostic.
2/15/2016 11:59:15 AM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
olderthandirt20 Waldron, AR 69, joined Jul. 2014 online now!	If you ask most Christians whether children who die when they are very young will go to heaven, They will say yes. So it would be most reasonable to kill your children while young (especially since children today are much more likely to become atheists), rather than risk them leaving the Christian faith.
2/15/2016 12:51:24 PM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
followjesusonly Kingman, AZ 73, joined May. 2012	Quote from ludlowlowell: Supposing---just supposing now---those crazy old Christians are right, and Jesus Christ really is the Incarnate Son of God and the Savior of the world, and just supposing---hey, call it supposing for laughs and grins---all non-believers in Jesus will be sent to burn in Hell forever. Why not believe in Jesus, just as a form of fire insurance? We shell out good money to make sure we are reumbursed if our houses burn down. Why not a little insurance for the soul? And what does it cost? Nothing! Unlike State Farm, Geico, and Progressive, there are no premiums to pay. True, we have to give up our sins, but our sins oppress us, don't they, even in this life. And true, we have to love God above all else, but that's eady to do because God is so lovable. Everything to gain, nothing to lose. What people these days call a win-win situation. Opening one's mind to the idea that we need to believe in Jesus because if we don't He will send us to Hell forever, opens one's mind up to the other insane beliefs you harbor. All of them. The mere act of "supposing" what you say is extremely dangerous, and it's a clever mind trick leading people down the path that you're on. Once the mind accepts an unreal premise, it's a slippery slope into unreality where you are. There are some things better left un-supposed. What you suggest is not the right reason to "believe in Jesus." It's the wrong reason. You yourself are in a lot of trouble. You have said, "God ... sends people to Hell who don't love Him back." And Jesus has said that you don't love God because you don't obey God and you refuse to obey God. Supposing---just supposing now---that what you said is right, that God sends people to Hell who don't love Him back, and that Jesus is right that you don't love Him because you refuse to obey Him, wouldn't it be good insurance for you to obey Jesus? Why not obey Jesus, just for insurance, just to be on the safe side? If you could go to Hell because you don't love God, as you say and as Jesus says, all you have to do is obey Him. That's good insurance. People should love God because He is good and because they want to be like Him, not because He will punish them if they don't love Him. Even suggesting that God will punish people for not loving him is unreality, mental blackmail, and blasphemy against God. Your problem, or one of them, is that you do not love God and you do not know God, as John says: He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. (1 John 2:4) Jesus: "Why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?" (Luke 6:46) "If a man love me, he will keep my words."(John 14:23) "He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings." (John 14:24) And the word which you have heard, is not mine; but the Father's who sent me." (John 14:24) You have everything to gain, and nothing to lose by obeying Jesus. What people these days call a win-win situation. [Edited 2/15/2016 12:52:55 PM ]
2/15/2016 1:03:45 PM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
followjesusonly Kingman, AZ 73, joined May. 2012	Quote from clarence2: You're right, it's a good selling point for the Abrahamic God that he threatens to hurt people who don't believe in him and represents a ploy that's sure to persuade many weak minded individuals or folks who have grown up indoctrinated with a fear of hell. More rational people though will tend to think a god who coerces with threats is no more likely to exist than harmless gods who don't threaten. Those folks will most likely continue to happily worship their own gods or will remain atheistic or agnostic. Pretty well said, Clarence. But it's not only a "ploy," it's a very dangerous mind control technique. "Just suppose..." they say, or "Imagine for a minute..." or "Just for argument's sake...", this is a dangerous mind trick that causes one to accept a wrong premise momentarily. People have been flipped by this technique. And once they're flipped into unreality, like Ludlow has been flipped, they want to flip others. That's what Ludlow is doing.
2/15/2016 1:16:04 PM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
olderthandirt20 Waldron, AR 69, joined Jul. 2014 online now!	Suppose the mormons are right wouldn't that be a fine kettle of fish? ludlow isn't covered for that and his god won't let him buy that policy either. no more win-win
2/15/2016 1:36:00 PM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
followjesusonly Kingman, AZ 73, joined May. 2012	* Ludlow also cleverly, and possibly Satanically, mixes in some things that are believable and suppose-able, right in with the insane supposition. This makes it harder to not suppose what Ludlow wants you to suppose. These are some of the extraneous, irrelevant, but somewhat believable suppositions thrown in to help carry the sale: "Jesus Christ really is the Incarnate Son of God and the Savior of the world." A person might be able to accept those, and then Ludlow throws in the other one, "for laughs and grins" he says, "all non-believers in Jesus will be sent to burn in Hell forever, Why not believe in Jesus, just as a form of fire insurance?" So a person accepts the first two premises, maybe already had before, and then Ludlow slips in the last one, the unreal one, the Satanic one, 'just suppose this one too,' "just for laughs and grins" he says. This is evil, Satanic mind manipulation at its worst. And it's from someone who Jesus says DOES NOT LOVE GOD because he refuses to obey God. "If a man love me, he will keep my words."(John 14:23) "He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings." (John 14:24) A loving God would NEVER send anyone to a place of eternal torture for not loving Him. Such beliefs are insanity and such restated ideas are blasphemy against God.
2/15/2016 2:58:51 PM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
asanb Sanbornton, NH 60, joined Jul. 2012	This conversation speaks volumes about the nature of Belief.
2/15/2016 3:06:47 PM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
followjesusonly Kingman, AZ 73, joined May. 2012	* I must say OTD is right on with this one: "Suppose the mormons are right wouldn't that be a fine kettle of fish? ludlow isn't covered for that and his god won't let him buy that policy either. no more win-win"
2/15/2016 3:14:28 PM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
clarence2 South Yorkshire United Kingdom 58, joined May. 2011	Does the Mormon God make threats? Isn't it the same as the Christian God but with Joseph Smith adding his two penn'orth to the belief system, much like William Sadler does in the UB?
2/15/2016 4:06:45 PM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
olderthandirt20 Waldron, AR 69, joined Jul. 2014 online now!	Quote from clarence2: Does the Mormon God make threats? Isn't it the same as the Christian God but with Joseph Smith adding his two penn'orth to the belief system, much like William Sadler does in the UB? I think you are correct it is an adaptation of the christian god much like Sadlers, however with luds contention that only catholics can get into heaven? Well Mormons believe that they too can become a "God" and rule over "earths" like our Heavenly Father does. Joseph Smith taught “It is the first principle of the Gospel to learn how to be Gods yourselves ...the same as all Gods have done before you…” Brigham Young also taught “You will become Eves to earths like this; and when you have assisted in peopling one earth, there are millions of earths still in the course of creation.”— Journal of Discourses,vol. 8, p. 208
2/15/2016 4:26:52 PM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
followjesusonly Kingman, AZ 73, joined May. 2012	Quote from clarence2: Does the Mormon God make threats? This is right, Clarence. I asked basically the same thing on the "potato" thread. Is the Christian religion the only one in the world that threatens non believers with torture at God's hands if they don't believe as the Christians do? Their teaching is a disservice to, and blasphemy to God.
2/15/2016 6:56:45 PM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 63, joined Feb. 2008 online now!	"The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom.". ---Psalm 111:10
2/15/2016 7:25:38 PM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
olderthandirt20 Waldron, AR 69, joined Jul. 2014 online now!	“O You who believe! Enter absolutely into peace (Islam). Do not follow in the footsteps of satan. He is an outright enemy to you.” (Holy Quran: 2, 208)
2/15/2016 8:18:57 PM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
followjesusonly Kingman, AZ 73, joined May. 2012	Quote from ludlowlowell: "The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom.". ---Psalm 111:10 It's shameful, that in the 21st century, your beliefs are so still so primitive. I don't even believe they are your beliefs. I think you just use the bible to dredge up false counter assertions in your froward role. THE “FEAR OF THE LORD” (-The Urantia Book) 149:6.1 It was at Gamala, during the evening conference, that Philip said to Jesus: “Master, why is it that the Scriptures instruct us to ‘fear the Lord,’ while you would have us look to the Father in heaven without fear? How are we to harmonize these teachings?” And Jesus replied to Philip, saying: 149:6.2 “My children, I am not surprised that you ask such questions. In the beginning it was only through fear that man could learn reverence, but I have come to reveal the Father’s love so that you will be attracted to the worship of the Eternal by the drawing of a son’s affectionate recognition and reciprocation of the Father’s profound and perfect love. I would deliver you from the bondage of driving yourselves through slavish fear to the irksome service of a jealous and wrathful King-God. I would instruct you in the Father-son relationship of God and man so that you may be joyfully led into that sublime and supernal free worship of a loving, just, and merciful Father-God. 149:6.3 “The ‘fear of the Lord’ has had different meanings in the successive ages, coming up from fear, through anguish and dread, to awe and reverence. And now from reverence I would lead you up, through recognition, realization, and appreciation, to love. When man recognizes only the works of God, he is led to fear the Supreme; but when man begins to understand and experience the personality and character of the living God, he is led increasingly to love such a good and perfect, universal and eternal Father. And it is just this changing of the relation of man to God that constitutes the mission of the Son of Man on earth. 149:6.4 “Intelligent children do not fear their father in order that they may receive good gifts from his hand; but having already received the abundance of good things bestowed by the dictates of the father’s affection for his sons and daughters, these much loved children are led to love their father in responsive recognition and appreciation of such munificent beneficence. The goodness of God leads to repentance; the beneficence of God leads to service; the mercy of God leads to salvation; while the love of God leads to intelligent and freehearted worship. 149:6.5 “Your forebears feared God because he was mighty and mysterious. You shall adore him because he is magnificent in love, plenteous in mercy, and glorious in truth. The power of God engenders fear in the heart of man, but the nobility and righteousness of his personality beget reverence, love, and willing worship. A dutiful and affectionate son does not fear or dread even a mighty and noble father. I have come into the world to put love in the place of fear, joy in the place of sorrow, confidence in the place of dread, loving service and appreciative worship in the place of slavish bondage and meaningless ceremonies. But it is still true of those who sit in darkness that ‘the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom.’ But when the light has more fully come, the sons of God are led to praise the Infinite for what he is rather than to fear him for what he does. 149:6.6 “When children are young and unthinking, they must necessarily be admonished to honor their parents; but when they grow older and become somewhat more appreciative of the benefits of the parental ministry and protection, they are led up, through understanding respect and increasing affection, to that level of experience where they actually love their parents for what they are more than for what they have done. The father naturally loves his child, but the child must develop his love for the father from the fear of what the father can do, through awe, dread, dependence, and reverence, to the appreciative and affectionate regard of love. 149:6.7 “You have been taught that you should ‘fear God and keep his commandments, for that is the whole duty of man.’ But I have come to give you a new and higher commandment. I would teach you to ‘love God and learn to do his will, for that is the highest privilege of the liberated sons of God.’ Your fathers were taught to ‘fear God—the Almighty King.’ I teach you, ‘Love God—the all-merciful Father.’ 149:6.8 “In the kingdom of heaven, which I have come to declare, there is no high and mighty king; this kingdom is a divine family. The universally recognized and unreservedly worshiped center and head of this far-flung brotherhood of intelligent beings is my Father and your Father. I am his Son, and you are also his sons. Therefore it is eternally true that you and I are brethren in the heavenly estate, and all the more so since we have become brethren in the flesh of the earthly life. Cease, then, to fear God as a king or serve him as a master; learn to reverence him as the Creator; honor him as the Father of your spirit youth; love him as a merciful defender; and ultimately worship him as the loving and all-wise Father of your more mature spiritual realization and appreciation. Continued in Part 2
2/15/2016 8:19:07 PM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
followjesusonly Kingman, AZ 73, joined May. 2012	Part 2 149:6.9 “Out of your wrong concepts of the Father in heaven grow your false ideas of humility and springs much of your hypocrisy. Man may be a worm of the dust by nature and origin, but when he becomes indwelt by my Father’s spirit, that man becomes divine in his destiny. The bestowal spirit of my Father will surely return to the divine source and universe level of origin, and the human soul of mortal man which shall have become the reborn child of this indwelling spirit shall certainly ascend with the divine spirit to the very presence of the eternal Father. 149:6.10 “Humility, indeed, becomes mortal man who receives all these gifts from the Father in heaven, albeit there is a divine dignity attached to all such faith candidates for the eternal ascent of the heavenly kingdom. The meaningless and menial practices of an ostentatious and false humility are incompatible with the appreciation of the source of your salvation and the recognition of the destiny of your spirit-born souls. Humility before God is altogether appropriate in the depths of your hearts; meekness before men is commendable; but the hypocrisy of self-conscious and attention-craving humility is childish and unworthy of the enlightened sons of the kingdom. 149:6.11 “You do well to be meek before God and self-controlled before men, but let your meekness be of spiritual origin and not the self-deceptive display of a self-conscious sense of self-righteous superiority. The prophet spoke advisedly when he said, ‘Walk humbly with God,’ for, while the Father in heaven is the Infinite and the Eternal, he also dwells ‘with him who is of a contrite mind and a humble spirit.’ My Father disdains pride, loathes hypocrisy, and abhors iniquity. And it was to emphasize the value of sincerity and perfect trust in the loving support and faithful guidance of the heavenly Father that I have so often referred to the little child as illustrative of the attitude of mind and the response of spirit which are so essential to the entrance of mortal man into the spirit realities of the kingdom of heaven. 149:6.12 “Well did the Prophet Jeremiah describe many mortals when he said: ‘You are near God in the mouth but far from him in the heart.’ And have you not also read that direful warning of the prophet who said: ‘The priests thereof teach for hire, and the prophets thereof divine for money. At the same time they profess piety and proclaim that the Lord is with them.’ Have you not been well warned against those who ‘speak peace to their neighbors when mischief is in their hearts,’ those who ‘flatter with the lips while the heart is given to double-dealing’? Of all the sorrows of a trusting man, none are so terrible as to be ‘wounded in the house of a trusted friend.’” [I bolded one sentence above that is, imo, a direct parallel with "To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth." (John 18:37)]
2/15/2016 8:25:43 PM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
aphrodisianus Leander, TX 66, joined Oct. 2013	Quote from ludlowlowell: Supposing---just supposing now---those crazy old Christians are right, and Jesus Christ really is the Incarnate Son of God and the Savior of the world, and just supposing---hey, call it supposing for laughs and grins---all non-believers in Jesus will be sent to burn in Hell forever. Why not believe in Jesus, just as a form of fire insurance? We shell out good money to make sure we are reumbursed if our houses burn down. Why not a little insurance for the soul? And what does it cost? Nothing! Unlike State Farm, Geico, and Progressive, there are no premiums to pay. True, we have to give up our sins, but our sins oppress us, don't they, even in this life. And true, we have to love God above all else, but that's eady to do because God is so lovable. Everything to gain, nothing to lose. What people these days call a win-win situation. If you have medical insurance you should see a psychiatrist. Why not have insurance for your mental health? You just pay a co-pay or deductible learn about your mental condition and get treatment for your delusions.
2/18/2016 8:46:36 PM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
isna_la_wica Brantford, ON 62, joined Mar. 2012	Quote from ludlowlowell: Supposing---just supposing now---those crazy old Christians are right, and Jesus Christ really is the Incarnate Son of God and the Savior of the world, and just supposing---hey, call it supposing for laughs and grins---all non-believers in Jesus will be sent to burn in Hell forever. Why not believe in Jesus, just as a form of fire insurance? We shell out good money to make sure we are reumbursed if our houses burn down. Why not a little insurance for the soul? And what does it cost? Nothing! Unlike State Farm, Geico, and Progressive, there are no premiums to pay. True, we have to give up our sins, but our sins oppress us, don't they, even in this life. And true, we have to love God above all else, but that's eady to do because God is so lovable. Everything to gain, nothing to lose. What people these days call a win-win situation. So, the only reason you follow Jesus, is you are afraid of burning in Hell? I would be kinda sad, if I found out my kids only loved me because they feared,,,,not loving me. You are saying people should join Christ, out of fear. Much liker an abused woman, staying with her husband. Kinda sad.
2/18/2016 9:19:44 PM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
followjesusonly Kingman, AZ 73, joined May. 2012	It's terrible sad.
2/19/2016 3:32:32 AM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
sail_dancer Saint Petersburg, FL 68, joined Apr. 2010	Quote from isna_la_wica: So, the only reason you follow Jesus, is you are afraid of burning in Hell? I would be kinda sad, if I found out my kids only loved me because they feared,,,,not loving me. You are saying people should join Christ, out of fear. Much liker an abused woman, staying with her husband. Kinda sad. Peace
2/19/2016 3:33:32 AM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
sail_dancer Saint Petersburg, FL 68, joined Apr. 2010	Quote from aphrodisianus: If you have medical insurance you should see a psychiatrist. Why not have insurance for your mental health? You just pay a co-pay or deductible learn about your mental condition and get treatment for your delusions. Peace
2/19/2016 8:09:27 AM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
nonstandard York, PA 53, joined Jun. 2009	The sacred club that crucified Jesus didn't love him , and they didn't believe that they were going to burn in hell either . Their faith exists , to justify whatever they want to do .
2/19/2016 9:31:54 AM	Maybe we should get some fire insurance.
nonstandard York, PA 53, joined Jun. 2009	Maybe we should get some life insurance . Then we couldn't replace it , with lofty ideas .

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