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3/17/2017 6:48:38 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
mz_jeannie_baby
Over 1,000 Posts (1,169)
Rochester, MI
58, joined Sep. 2012


Arnulfo Solorio’s desperate mission to recruit farmworkers for the Napa Valley took him far from the pastoral vineyards to a raggedy parking lot in Stockton, in the heart of the Central Valley.

Carrying a fat stack of business cards for his company, Silverado Farming, Solorio approached one prospect, a man with only his bottom set of teeth. He told Solorio that farm work in Stockton pays $11 to $12 an hour. Solorio countered: “Look, we are paying $14.50 now, but we are going up to $16.” The man nodded skeptically.

Workers prune grapevines at the Napa Valley vineyard of Silverado Farming. Cabernet Sauvignon grapes in Napa go for nearly $6,900 per ton, 10 times more than in San Joaquin County. (Credit: Gary Coronado / Los Angeles Times)

Solorio moved on to two men huddled nearby, and returned quickly. “They were drug addicts,” he said. “And, they didn’t have a car.”

Before the day was through, Solorio would make the same pitch to dozens of men and women, approaching a taco truck, a restaurant and a homeless encampment. Time was short: He needed to find 100 workers to fill his ranks by April 1, when grapevines begin to grow and need constant attention..........................


Not quite sure about the 'drug addict' remarks as being anything more than subjective, but why won't they take the jobs???

Any idea's?


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3/17/2017 6:50:58 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
annamally
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (15,519)
Santa Clarita, CA
97, joined Feb. 2013


Quote from mz_jeannie_baby:
Arnulfo Solorio’s desperate mission to recruit farmworkers for the Napa Valley took him far from the pastoral vineyards to a raggedy parking lot in Stockton, in the heart of the Central Valley.

Carrying a fat stack of business cards for his company, Silverado Farming, Solorio approached one prospect, a man with only his bottom set of teeth. He told Solorio that farm work in Stockton pays $11 to $12 an hour. Solorio countered: “Look, we are paying $14.50 now, but we are going up to $16.” The man nodded skeptically.

Workers prune grapevines at the Napa Valley vineyard of Silverado Farming. Cabernet Sauvignon grapes in Napa go for nearly $6,900 per ton, 10 times more than in San Joaquin County. (Credit: Gary Coronado / Los Angeles Times)

Solorio moved on to two men huddled nearby, and returned quickly. “They were drug addicts,” he said. “And, they didn’t have a car.”

Before the day was through, Solorio would make the same pitch to dozens of men and women, approaching a taco truck, a restaurant and a homeless encampment. Time was short: He needed to find 100 workers to fill his ranks by April 1, when grapevines begin to grow and need constant attention..........................


Not quite sure about the 'drug addict' remarks as being anything more than subjective, but why won't they take the jobs???

Any idea's?



Government welfare .....

3/17/2017 6:52:22 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
mz_jeannie_baby
Over 1,000 Posts (1,169)
Rochester, MI
58, joined Sep. 2012


Solorio is one of a growing number of agricultural businessmen who say they face an urgent shortage of workers. The flow of labor began drying up when President Obama tightened the border. Now President Trump is promising to deport more people, raid more companies and build a wall on the southern border.

3/17/2017 6:54:28 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
annamally
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (15,519)
Santa Clarita, CA
97, joined Feb. 2013


When Trump cuts welfare .... They will get their asses back to work .

3/17/2017 6:56:11 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

w6o6l6f_1
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (18,152)
Richmond, VA
40, joined May. 2014


No link?

3/17/2017 6:57:51 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
mz_jeannie_baby
Over 1,000 Posts (1,169)
Rochester, MI
58, joined Sep. 2012


Quote from annamally:
When Trump cuts welfare .... They will get their asses back to work .


Long hours I suppose, not sure about the wages being good but have to be better than what they receive now, welfare is peanuts...grapes pay more.

So, why not want to work?

3/17/2017 7:00:58 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
mz_jeannie_baby
Over 1,000 Posts (1,169)
Rochester, MI
58, joined Sep. 2012


ktla.com add topic title to see it in entirety

3/17/2017 7:06:55 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

thekinghasrisen
Over 7,500 Posts!! (8,148)
San Diego, CA
33, joined Nov. 2013


Quote from annamally:
When Trump cuts welfare .... They will get their asses back to work .


And if they don't?

Do you truly believe that there's a politician alive that is willing to say - on camera: let the chronically poor and sick/addicted die?

That attack ad write's itself so well that even the lowest IQ voter can read and understand it.

3/17/2017 7:15:48 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
annamally
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (15,519)
Santa Clarita, CA
97, joined Feb. 2013


Quote from mz_jeannie_baby:
Long hours I suppose, not sure about the wages being good but have to be better than what they receive now, welfare is peanuts...grapes pay more.

So, why not want to work?


This is how is works .... Guy knocks up girl , they have baby . Mother does not put fathers name on BC , they move in together . Mother and child collect welfare while father works . If they need some extra cash they sell their foodstamp card . They live in section 8 housing and pay about $60 a month in rent .
They don't pay any taxes and receive thousands of dollars back as an Earned Income Tax Rebate every year.

WHY ????? Would they change a thing ????

3/17/2017 7:19:51 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

reginamc
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (15,930)
Las Vegas, NV
62, joined Mar. 2011


Quote from annamally:
This is how is works .... Guy knocks up girl , they have baby . Mother does not put fathers name on BC , they move in together . Mother and child collect welfare while father works . If they need some extra cash they sell their foodstamp card . They live in section 8 housing and pay about $60 a month in rent .
They don't pay any taxes and receive thousands of dollars back as an Earned Income Tax Rebate every year.

WHY ????? Would they change a thing ????


Yep. And working becomes a foreign concept to people who have no idea of any structure in their life. They can't imagine it, like those of us who work all the time can't imagine staying home any more.

3/17/2017 7:24:46 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
mz_jeannie_baby
Over 1,000 Posts (1,169)
Rochester, MI
58, joined Sep. 2012


Quote from annamally:
This is how is works .... Guy knocks up girl , they have baby . Mother does not put fathers name on BC , they move in together . Mother and child collect welfare while father works . If they need some extra cash they sell their foodstamp card . They live in section 8 housing and pay about $60 a month in rent .
They don't pay any taxes and receive thousands of dollars back as an Earned Income Tax Rebate every year.

WHY ????? Would they change a thing ????


I suppose this has happened truth be told, but without the variables contributing to it...or adding another thread on 'welfare'....I find it hard to believe welfare is so luxurious that one would 'prefer' it over the ability to earn a decent (decent) wage for a day's work.

What's happened?

Barring mental health...why does/would it appeal to someone?

Mexican people at large relished these jobs.

Why not us?

3/17/2017 7:28:26 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
mz_jeannie_baby
Over 1,000 Posts (1,169)
Rochester, MI
58, joined Sep. 2012


Quote from reginamc:
Yep. And working becomes a foreign concept to people who have no idea of any structure in their life. They can't imagine it, like those of us who work all the time can't imagine staying home any more.


Structure in their life is an answer without condemnation...anyone else?

3/17/2017 7:30:10 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

reginamc
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (15,930)
Las Vegas, NV
62, joined Mar. 2011


Quote from mz_jeannie_baby:
Structure in their life is an answer without condemnation...anyone else?


I have no idea what that means.

3/17/2017 7:34:12 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
mz_jeannie_baby
Over 1,000 Posts (1,169)
Rochester, MI
58, joined Sep. 2012


Quote from reginamc:
I have no idea what that means.


Sometimes people have a tone of disliking the poor it can seem...sometimes as if they've done something wrong deserving of condemnation.

You gave a reason for their dilemma...lack of structure, similar to boundaries for children, without them they can run the streets.

Just exploring possible 'reasons' within the topic.

3/17/2017 7:37:18 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

reginamc
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (15,930)
Las Vegas, NV
62, joined Mar. 2011


Quote from mz_jeannie_baby:
Sometimes people have a tone of disliking the poor it can seem...sometimes as if they've done something wrong deserving of condemnation.

You gave a reason for their dilemma...lack of structure, similar to boundaries for children, without them they can run the streets.

Just exploring possible 'reasons' within the topic.


uh, ok

3/17/2017 7:39:48 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
rocky_dennis
Over 2,000 Posts (3,676)
Mechanicsburg, PA
39, joined Nov. 2013


Why won't they take the jobs? Because Alf went to the streets where junkies, wh*res and dealers spend their time. They're not looking for a job. He should be camped out near a temp agency, where people are looking for work.

3/17/2017 7:41:33 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

reginamc
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (15,930)
Las Vegas, NV
62, joined Mar. 2011


Quote from rocky_dennis:
Why won't they take the jobs? Because Alf went to the streets where junkies, wh*res and dealers spend their time. They're not looking for a job. He should be camped out near a temp agency, where people are looking for work.



So true

3/17/2017 7:43:17 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
mz_jeannie_baby
Over 1,000 Posts (1,169)
Rochester, MI
58, joined Sep. 2012


Quote from rocky_dennis:
Why won't they take the jobs? Because Alf went to the streets where junkies, wh*res and dealers spend their time. They're not looking for a job. He should be camped out near a temp agency, where people are looking for work.


You could have a 'junkie' drilling on your teeth.

The difference between your dentist and the so called street junkie is one has money, one maybe didn't have that structure in his/her life someone else talked about.

Many 'working' junkies buddy.

Why wouldn't anyone want out of the cycle of poverty?

3/17/2017 7:47:25 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
annamally
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (15,519)
Santa Clarita, CA
97, joined Feb. 2013


Quote from mz_jeannie_baby:
You could have a 'junkie' drilling on your teeth.

The difference between your dentist and the so called street junkie is one has money, one maybe didn't have that structure in his/her life someone else talked about.

Many 'working' junkies buddy.

Why wouldn't anyone want out of the cycle of poverty?


Because it pays well in the long run ....

It's NOT the " poverty " you think it is ...

They live in nice homes , drive nice cars , eat whatever they want , and really don't have to do anything for it .

Oh ! Except ! ..... LIE !



[Edited 3/17/2017 7:47:48 PM ]

3/17/2017 7:48:25 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

reginamc
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (15,930)
Las Vegas, NV
62, joined Mar. 2011


Quote from mz_jeannie_baby:
You could have a 'junkie' drilling on your teeth.

The difference between your dentist and the so called street junkie is one has money, one maybe didn't have that structure in his/her life someone else talked about.

Many 'working' junkies buddy.

Why wouldn't anyone want out of the cycle of poverty?


BECAUSE THEY GET BY AND THEY'RE LAZY.








Possible 'chatting' detected. You have already posted in this thread recently. Please wait for some other people to reply before posting in this thread again, or wait like an hour or so, whichever comes first. Sorry for the inconvenience.

This message might annoy you a bit, however we want to make sure more than a couple of people get a chance to respond in a thread. The 'chat' forums and groups don't have this restriction, only a few forums actually have it. You will almost never get this message if you post thoughtful, on-topic replies.

3/17/2017 7:50:38 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
mz_jeannie_baby
Over 1,000 Posts (1,169)
Rochester, MI
58, joined Sep. 2012


Quote from annamally:
Because it pays well in the long run ....

It's NOT the " poverty " you think it is ...

They live in nice homes , drive nice cars , eat whatever they want , and really don't have to do anything for it .

Oh ! Except ! ..... LIE !


What then is " your " definition of poverty?

3/17/2017 7:58:19 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

thekinghasrisen
Over 7,500 Posts!! (8,148)
San Diego, CA
33, joined Nov. 2013


Quote from annamally:
This is how is works .... Guy knocks up girl , they have baby . Mother does not put fathers name on BC , they move in together . Mother and child collect welfare while father works . If they need some extra cash they sell their foodstamp card . They live in section 8 housing and pay about $60 a month in rent .
They don't pay any taxes and receive thousands of dollars back as an Earned Income Tax Rebate every year.

WHY ????? Would they change a thing ????


Um...because what you described sucks. Do you think that you're the only one who can see that? Really?

This is exactly the dehumanization of people on government assistance that helps to keep us divided. Let me tell you something that you might not want to hear: no one plans to be on public assistance. No loving parent prepares their daughter/son to follow in their shoes of poverty so completely that they are able to navigate the system in their early-to-mid twenties. This is an implicit bias that should be recognized and acknowledged. Thankfully, it's getting more attention than it use to.

If you know anyone like that who (face to face) told you their master plan to bilk the government, and you didn't turn them in for their crimes (and what you describe is indeed CRIMINAL), than you're not their friend.

If you don't know someone personally who engaged in this matter, than...

3/17/2017 7:59:36 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
annamally
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (15,519)
Santa Clarita, CA
97, joined Feb. 2013


Quote from mz_jeannie_baby:
What then is " your " definition of poverty?


I think you have to look outside the USA for the REAL definition ..... Of poverty !

3/17/2017 8:00:30 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
mz_jeannie_baby
Over 1,000 Posts (1,169)
Rochester, MI
58, joined Sep. 2012


hmmm...

nice cars, warm place to live, good foods not just refined sugars, dental care, medical care....we should all be good and poor by now "defending our American Way of Life" by your standards then...


hmmm...

is your concept of poverty that much in a nut shell?

do you have one?

Because it pays well in the long run ....

It's NOT the " poverty " you think it is ...

They live in nice homes , drive nice cars , eat whatever they want , and really don't have to do anything for it .




[Edited 3/17/2017 8:01:48 PM ]

3/17/2017 8:02:40 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

reginamc
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (15,930)
Las Vegas, NV
62, joined Mar. 2011


King, it might seem to suck to you and me but it's a big deal with a lot of people to make it onto welfare or disability or foodstamps or whatever, they're proud as hell. It's money in the mailbox, they love it.

3/17/2017 8:03:06 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
annamally
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (15,519)
Santa Clarita, CA
97, joined Feb. 2013


Quote from thekinghasrisen:
Um...because what you described sucks. Do you think that you're the only one who can see that? Really?

This is exactly the dehumanization of people on government assistance that helps to keep us divided. Let me tell you something that you might not want to hear: no one plans to be on public assistance. No loving parent prepares their daughter/son to follow in their shoes of poverty so completely that they are able to navigate the system in their early-to-mid twenties. This is an implicit bias that should be recognized and acknowledged. Thankfully, it's getting more attention than it use to.

If you know anyone like that who (face to face) told you their master plan to bilk the government, and you didn't turn them in for their crimes (and what you describe is indeed CRIMINAL), than you're not their friend.

If you don't know someone personally who engaged in this matter, than...


Slap yourself in the face and WAKE UP !!!!

Public assistance .... Became generational long ago !

Don't pretend .... YOU don't know/see that !

3/17/2017 8:06:24 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
mz_jeannie_baby
Over 1,000 Posts (1,169)
Rochester, MI
58, joined Sep. 2012


the grapes will rot on the vine

a sign of the times. later

3/17/2017 8:06:37 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

thekinghasrisen
Over 7,500 Posts!! (8,148)
San Diego, CA
33, joined Nov. 2013


Quote from annamally:
I think you have to look outside the USA for the REAL definition ..... Of poverty !


Nope.

Let's agree not to do that: let's not judge some parts of society against each other, and others against the entire world, just because it gets dissenters to turn divert their eyes from the topic at hand.

If we wouldn't take the richest man in America, compare him to richest man in Africa (a 60 or so billion dollar difference), and say that said American billionaire should be happy living anywhere above the African billionaire's level (even though it's closer to true than most want to admit)...so let's not do the same with the poor and defenseless. Please and thank you.

3/17/2017 8:08:36 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

thekinghasrisen
Over 7,500 Posts!! (8,148)
San Diego, CA
33, joined Nov. 2013


Quote from annamally:
Slap yourself in the face and WAKE UP !!!!

Public assistance .... Became generational long ago !

Don't pretend .... YOU don't know/see that !


Ok, I'll bite -

How and why do you believe that public assistance is 'generational': i.e. passed down and taught to generations for practical use?

3/17/2017 8:10:34 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

thekinghasrisen
Over 7,500 Posts!! (8,148)
San Diego, CA
33, joined Nov. 2013


Quote from reginamc:
King, it might seem to suck to you and me but it's a big deal with a lot of people to make it onto welfare or disability or foodstamps or whatever, they're proud as hell. It's money in the mailbox, they love it.


You appear to know a lot of these people. Did you ever stop to ask them why they prefer the cycle of poverty to a shot at prosperity for themselves and their children?

3/17/2017 8:14:45 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
annamally
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (15,519)
Santa Clarita, CA
97, joined Feb. 2013


Quote from thekinghasrisen:
Ok, I'll bite -

How and why do you believe that public assistance is 'generational': i.e. passed down and taught to generations for practical use?


I'm a registered nurse and worked in a few county hospitals ....

I'm also NOT blinded like you ....

I've worked with people who's children end up on assistance and have babies who are on assistance .

I have followed at least 3 generations ...



[Edited 3/17/2017 8:17:23 PM ]

3/17/2017 8:15:50 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
ohdona
Over 4,000 Posts! (5,000)
Lansing, MI
49, joined Dec. 2011


Quote from thekinghasrisen:
And if they don't?

Do you truly believe that there's a politician alive that is willing to say - on camera: let the chronically poor and sick/addicted die?

That attack ad write's itself so well that even the lowest IQ voter can read and understand it.


But, they will still vote against their own intersets.

3/17/2017 8:18:11 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

reginamc
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (15,930)
Las Vegas, NV
62, joined Mar. 2011


No but I've seen them watch their hours like hawks so they don't lose their benefits, even walk out in the middle of their shift because they might "go over", and I've seen mothers teaching their daughters how to use WIC checks and say "that's what I used to get with you" - and I can't tell you how many I've seen happy to death that they got their food stamps, or got them increased. I know several people on Medicaid who pay NOTHING for doctor visits, prescriptions ... nothing. It's money for free - people like that, you know.

3/17/2017 8:20:13 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
mralwaysrite
Over 4,000 Posts! (4,511)
Estevan, SK
55, joined Feb. 2014


Hint;

The Filipinos are now Canada's top source of immigrants/temporary workers.....they are willing to work for minimum wage, and are much smarter/more educated than Mexicans, and they speak English!.

3/17/2017 8:25:37 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
annamally
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (15,519)
Santa Clarita, CA
97, joined Feb. 2013


Quote from reginamc:
No but I've seen them watch their hours like hawks so they don't lose their benefits, even walk out in the middle of their shift because they might "go over", and I've seen mothers teaching their daughters how to use WIC checks and say "that's what I used to get with you" - and I can't tell you how many I've seen happy to death that they got their food stamps, or got them increased. I know several people on Medicaid who pay NOTHING for doctor visits, prescriptions ... nothing. It's money for free - people like that, you know.


Liberals just don't get .... What's truly going on !

3/17/2017 9:51:10 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

thekinghasrisen
Over 7,500 Posts!! (8,148)
San Diego, CA
33, joined Nov. 2013


Quote from ohdona:
But, they will still vote against their own intersets.


The true challenge of politicians is to convince the American people that the broader long term goals are in their interest, even if the short term results don't bear that out in the facts.

3/17/2017 10:01:02 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

viper1e
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (19,478)
Greensburg, PA
59, joined Dec. 2013


Quote from analmommy:
This is how is works .... Guy knocks up girl , they have baby . Mother does not put fathers name on BC , they move in together . Mother and child collect welfare while father works . If they need some extra cash they sell their foodstamp card . They live in section 8 housing and pay about $60 a month in rent .
They don't pay any taxes and receive thousands of dollars back as an Earned Income Tax Rebate every year.


Your autobiography doesn't carry all that much weight.

Most people don't live their lives looking for ways to game the system.

3/17/2017 11:15:35 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
mustangwriter
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (24,547)
Boerne, TX
57, joined Nov. 2009


After the economic reset farmers will be the new millionaires.

3/17/2017 11:21:53 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

jitssbaby617
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (18,498)
Roslindale, MA
39, joined Jun. 2014


Farmers are American lol

What is wrong with you liberals?? Lol

If your talking about huge companies hiring Mexicans that's not the same as small farms that all family owned and run by white Americans.

3/18/2017 6:17:23 AM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
rocky_dennis
Over 2,000 Posts (3,676)
Mechanicsburg, PA
39, joined Nov. 2013


Quote from mz_jeannie_baby:
You could have a 'junkie' drilling on your teeth.

The difference between your dentist and the so called street junkie is one has money, one maybe didn't have that structure in his/her life someone else talked about.

Many 'working' junkies buddy.

Why wouldn't anyone want out of the cycle of poverty?


Is this about people not taking jobs, or comparing a street junkie's to someone that made it through medical school, started business and has a job?

If this guy is looking for workers, he needs to find people looking for work, like scabbing people looking for work at a temp agencies, as an example. Maybe he should go down to the county assistance office, tell them he needs workers now. Have the peoples case supervisor's, tell them they've a job for them. And they've to go to work then.



[Edited 3/18/2017 6:18:25 AM ]

3/18/2017 6:26:21 AM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
mz_jeannie_baby
Over 1,000 Posts (1,169)
Rochester, MI
58, joined Sep. 2012


Quote from reginamc:
No but I've seen them watch their hours like hawks so they don't lose their benefits, even walk out in the middle of their shift because they might "go over", and I've seen mothers teaching their daughters how to use WIC checks and say "that's what I used to get with you" - and I can't tell you how many I've seen happy to death that they got their food stamps, or got them increased. I know several people on Medicaid who pay NOTHING for doctor visits, prescriptions ... nothing. It's money for free - people like that, you know.


I feel no pity for Arny the farmer in this story. IF he has the ability to pay 16/hour now, why didn't he before??? It was labor for free - people like that, you know

An industry run on wage slavery, YET our neighbors over the border that have been so viciously attacked as 'stealing' American jobs have been willing to do it, look outside and beyond the box.

Consider the work itself, long, hot and unless acclimated to it would wipe someone out if they could last a day, drudgery...There are reasons certain 'jobs' were given to unskilled laborers, slave picking cotton jobs takes on the same scenario, long, hot drudgery....manual physical jobs requiring a physical capability.

We do not have a society that supports human capabilities and encourages them either.

Why does the most labor intensive job automatically align with the poor? Privileged education perhaps?

There is a detest in this country for the poor, a blame placed on them for being poor, a dislike that borders on hatred that they haven't entered into YOUR realm of a definition of a deserving job, the most meager of jobs that have offered peanuts in exchange for difficult and unfair working conditions. Perhaps we should ask of them to model after the child laborers that our corporations have shipped jobs to overseas.

OR, nursing and social workers. A much better idea I believe!! We could use persons with empathy (quite different than sympathy) that understands their culture without discriminating and judgement in who is deserving and undeserving within the population of the poor.

lengthy, I know. but let the grapes die on the vine, it really is a sign of the times.

3/18/2017 6:34:49 AM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

nuffan
Over 4,000 Posts! (6,590)
Kennesaw, GA
54, joined Mar. 2014


Quote from annamally:
This is how is works .... Guy knocks up girl , they have baby . Mother does not put fathers name on BC , they move in together . Mother and child collect welfare while father works . If they need some extra cash they sell their foodstamp card . They live in section 8 housing and pay about $60 a month in rent .
They don't pay any taxes and receive thousands of dollars back as an Earned Income Tax Rebate every year.

WHY ????? Would they change a thing ????



Yes there is the problem...

They have made it a VIABLE alternative to actually working....

We have given entirely too much control to the employer...

They do not like something you say...you're fired....

They do not like your political opinion...you're fired...

They do not like your new hair cut...you're fired...

and not every citizen can own their own business...lol

there are two type of citizens today...

the working class...

the investor class...

we are allowing a new type to evolve...

the entitled class...

the more and more policy continues to favor the investor class...and work against the working class...the entitlement class will continue to grow and evolve...

There are downsides to capitalism...like everything else...for all the ying...somewhere is a yang...

and it has been turned upside down since the early 80's and Reagonomics...

EXACTLY like was predicted almost 40 years ago...

3/18/2017 7:45:21 AM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

blake6972
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (30,124)
Bunker Hill, WV
45, joined Jul. 2013


A sign of what "times"?

Please , I am interested to know what you are referring to.

Also,how many more "sign of the times" are there?

In your thread title, you state Americans still won't take the jobs .

Should I assume that all the jobs that are being offered are to LEGAL DOCUMENTED Americans ?

If one turns down a job offer ( especially at the least a decent paying one) then obviously they (whoever "they" are) must be receiving some form of provisions to the point of contentment.

What are theses "provisions "?
Who is receiving them?
Why?
How long will they receive them?

Who is paying for the said provisions?

Maybe what is being offered (job/pay scale) isn't better than what they already have ,and or, what they are already receiving.

Dependency is a necessity (to certain degrees) but we have a huge monster with many tentacles overreaching the boundaries that were never truly instilled properly nor at all, and now we have a chaotic environment/atmosphere that is being cultivated , and fostered by another monster created by "political correctness" which is a freaking figment.

If a man is hungry, he/she will work (if physically/mentally capable) and be fed.
You don't just give a man a fish, you teach him how to fish.

We as a country have become enablers to a very corrupt system that is being very, very , very much abused.

Giving isn't only part of the solution, sometimes taking is more productive.

More importantly education and accountability .

No reason why all those job offers couldn't be filled.
Especially when a third of "Americans" are unemployed.



[Edited 3/18/2017 7:46:29 AM ]

3/18/2017 7:47:42 AM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

viper1e
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (19,478)
Greensburg, PA
59, joined Dec. 2013


Expect to see a lot more of this.

Donny would love to bring back slavery.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/realspin/2012/05/17/the-law-of-unintended-consequences-georgias-immigration-law-backfires/#3b22de1f492a

The Law Of Unintended Consequences: Georgia's Immigration Law Backfires

To forgo a repeat of last year, when labor shortages triggered an estimated $140 million in agricultural losses, as crops rotted in the fields, officials in Georgia are now dispatching prisoners to the state’s farms to help harvest fruit and vegetables.

The labor shortages, which also have affected the hotel and restaurant industries, are a consequence of Georgia’s immigration enforcement law, HB 87, which was passed last year. As State Rep. Matt Ramsey, one of the bill’s authors, said at the time, “Our goal is … to eliminate incentives for illegal aliens to cross into our state.”

Now he and others are learning: Be careful what you wish for, because you may get more than you bargained for.

Georgia’s law, similar to those in Alabama, Arizona and a few other states, gives police the authority to demand immigration documentation from suspects when they detain them for other possible violations. The law also makes it more difficult for businesses to hire workers and creates harsher punishments for those who employ or harbor illegal immigrants.

The Pew Hispanic Center estimated that some 425,000 illegal immigrants lived in Georgia when the legislation was passed – seventh highest in the nation. Those numbers are now down, as hoped for, but the state’s economy is paying a heavy price.

The dirty secret that everybody knew was that most of the state’s agricultural workers were immigrants, many of them illegal. Some lived in the state; others migrated with the harvest from southern Florida up to New York and back. Some of the former have moved away, while many of the latter are bypassing Georgia. Without them, according to a University of Georgia study, farmers were about 40 percent short of the number of workers they needed to harvest last year’s crop.

Despite high unemployment in the state, most Georgians don’t want such back-breaking jobs, nor do they have the necessary skills. According to D*ck Minor, president of the Georgia Fruit and Vegetable Grower’s Association, immigrants “are pretty much professional harvesters” with many specializing in particular crops.

Workers are paid by volume, with skilled workers typically earning $15 to $20 an hour. Unskilled workers earn much less, which is why most locals don’t want the jobs.

Georgia’s experience is consistent with economic research on immigration. Although many Americans believe immigrants “steal” our jobs and push down our wages, economists find little evidence of that.

Since 1950 the U.S. labor force has roughly doubled in size, but there has been no long-run increase in unemployment. Most economic studies also find little evidence that increased immigration depresses the wages of U.S. workers. At worst, it might push down the wages of high school dropouts, but even there the effect is small.

Simple supply and demand analysis would seem to indicate if you increase the supply of labor, wages will decline. But immigrants don’t simply increase the supply of labor. They supply skills that most Americans don’t have. As such, they don’t replace American workers so much as free them up to do other, typically more-skilled, things. This symbiotic relationship benefits immigrants and native-born alike.

Georgia’s immigration law has had precisely the effect the economic studies could have predicted. Farmers are having a hard time finding workers with the right skills to harvest their crops. As a result, Minor says, “A lot of the smaller growers have elected not to plant as many crops or to plant any crops.” These reductions cascade through the state economy and everybody loses.

Georgia’s immigration law wasn’t motivated solely by economic concerns, of course. Many Georgians also had concerns about the high cost of providing public services to illegal residents: schooling, medical care, law enforcement and other publicly funded services.

But there are better ways to handle such problems than by chasing away needed workers.

Georgia’s immigration law is a blunt instrument that is doing unnecessary harm to immigrants and native Georgians alike, making everyone poorer. Both Georgia, and any other state that’s considering a similar law, should reconsider.

3/18/2017 9:36:54 AM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
alls_fair
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (29,637)
Thorlákshöfn
Iceland
98, joined May. 2011


Quote from viper1e:


Since 1950 the U.S. labor force has roughly doubled in size, but there has been no long-run increase in unemployment. Most economic studies also find little evidence that increased immigration depresses the wages of U.S. workers. At worst, it might push down the wages of high school dropouts, but even there the effect is small.



I would have to see the results of those "studies" to take their conclusions under advisement...

There is a reason or group of reasons that the yooooonited states fed'ral gubment has NOT enforced immigration law for decades...

And I honestly do NOT think it has anything to do with altruism or humanitarian concerns!

(Keeping a cheap supply of labor for the recipients of the welfare for the rich programs orchestrated by ye olde fed'ral gubment appears to be the best viable reason.)

3/18/2017 9:49:59 AM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
drwookie
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (11,477)
Reading, PA
64, joined May. 2013


Quote from annamally:
This is how is works .... Guy knocks up girl , they have baby . Mother does not put fathers name on BC , they move in together . Mother and child collect welfare while father works . If they need some extra cash they sell their foodstamp card . They live in section 8 housing and pay about $60 a month in rent .
They don't pay any taxes and receive thousands of dollars back as an Earned Income Tax Rebate every year.
____________

Because it pays well in the long run ....

It's NOT the " poverty " you think it is ...

They live in nice homes , drive nice cars , eat whatever they want , and really don't have to do anything for it .

------------------------------------

Wanna play cognitive dissonance again?

I'm gonna go to the projects and admire all the Cadillacs and Lamborghinis they ride around in. Their busses are plush with a toilet and hot tub.

3/18/2017 10:57:45 AM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

mr_bad_robot
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (20,263)
Cincinnati, OH
42, joined Jul. 2014


mz_jeannie_baby you wrote:

"I feel no pity for Arny the farmer in this story. IF he has the ability to pay 16/hour now, why didn't he before??? It was labor for free - people like that, you know."


It's called the market theory of wage determination. Wages are influenced by several factors on the supply side and several factors on the demand side. If employers (demand) cannot find enough workers to meet their needs, they will keep raising their wage offers until more workers are attracted. If workers are in abundance (supply), wages will fall until the surplus labor decides to go elsewhere in search of jobs.

The vineyard owner in this case takes the standard wages of $11 to $12 an hour to $16 an hour by doing so he has eaten into his profits. This will force the other owners in the area to raise their wages to $16 an hour.

He could raise the selling price of his wine but that's not possible. Wine pricing is based on the quality of the wine and volume. Not every year is a great year for wine so the price varies year by year. A well known vineyard that produces quality wines in large volumes might be able to pay that $16 an hour. However an average vineyard might not be able to. If the wages keep going up the smaller average vineyards will shut down.

3/18/2017 12:29:43 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

reginamc
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (15,930)
Las Vegas, NV
62, joined Mar. 2011


Quote from mz_jeannie_baby:
I feel no pity for Arny the farmer in this story. IF he has the ability to pay 16/hour now, why didn't he before??? It was labor for free - people like that, you know

An industry run on wage slavery, YET our neighbors over the border that have been so viciously attacked as 'stealing' American jobs have been willing to do it, look outside and beyond the box.

Consider the work itself, long, hot and unless acclimated to it would wipe someone out if they could last a day, drudgery...There are reasons certain 'jobs' were given to unskilled laborers, slave picking cotton jobs takes on the same scenario, long, hot drudgery....manual physical jobs requiring a physical capability.

We do not have a society that supports human capabilities and encourages them either.

Why does the most labor intensive job automatically align with the poor? Privileged education perhaps?

There is a detest in this country for the poor, a blame placed on them for being poor, a dislike that borders on hatred that they haven't entered into YOUR realm of a definition of a deserving job, the most meager of jobs that have offered peanuts in exchange for difficult and unfair working conditions. Perhaps we should ask of them to model after the child laborers that our corporations have shipped jobs to overseas.

OR, nursing and social workers. A much better idea I believe!! We could use persons with empathy (quite different than sympathy) that understands their culture without discriminating and judgement in who is deserving and undeserving within the population of the poor.

lengthy, I know. but let the grapes die on the vine, it really is a sign of the times.


I can't follow a thing you write.

Nobody detests the poor for being poor, people "detest" the expectation by some that they should have the same lifestyle as working people with no effort put in by themselves other than showing up at their appointments at all their various aid agencies. They "detest" paying $800 a month and sharing a one bedroom with their kid while the person next to them in the same building gets a two bedroom (because according to welfare rules the child must have their own room) for $75 a month because they don't work. They detest seeing people buy a cart full of party food with a bakery cake on top with an EBT card. And they detest paying for their medical care while the person on Medicaid walks out of the office without even stopping at the desk. Sorry if you don't comprehend the unfairness of it. Good God woman.

3/19/2017 2:59:53 AM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
mz_jeannie_baby
Over 1,000 Posts (1,169)
Rochester, MI
58, joined Sep. 2012


I can't follow a thing you write.


house speaker Paul Ryan works 93 days a year for 180,000 dollars, full benefits and expenses.

attended college using social security funds and now works to cut public assistance.

he stated he believes people in the inner city have a culture problem and a lack of work ethic.

Is this confusing for you, can you follow me now?

viper's post is quite telling as well....is that confusing for you, too much to understand? can you follow that line of thinking?

sometimes the poorest people are the ones with the most money.

3/19/2017 3:31:25 AM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

stellar007
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (14,387)
Plymouth, MI
42, joined Dec. 2013


Quote from mz_jeannie_baby:
Arnulfo Solorio’s desperate mission to recruit farmworkers for the Napa Valley took him far from the pastoral vineyards to a raggedy parking lot in Stockton, in the heart of the Central Valley.

Carrying a fat stack of business cards for his company, Silverado Farming, Solorio approached one prospect, a man with only his bottom set of teeth. He told Solorio that farm work in Stockton pays $11 to $12 an hour. Solorio countered: “Look, we are paying $14.50 now, but we are going up to $16.” The man nodded skeptically.

Workers prune grapevines at the Napa Valley vineyard of Silverado Farming. Cabernet Sauvignon grapes in Napa go for nearly $6,900 per ton, 10 times more than in San Joaquin County. (Credit: Gary Coronado / Los Angeles Times)

Solorio moved on to two men huddled nearby, and returned quickly. “They were drug addicts,” he said. “And, they didn’t have a car.”

Before the day was through, Solorio would make the same pitch to dozens of men and women, approaching a taco truck, a restaurant and a homeless encampment. Time was short: He needed to find 100 workers to fill his ranks by April 1, when grapevines begin to grow and need constant attention..........................


Not quite sure about the 'drug addict' remarks as being anything more than subjective, but why won't they take the jobs???

Any idea's?


Any farmer that is still relying on humans to do the mundane job of planting or harvesting deserves what they get!

There isn't a single process in farming that can not be handled by a machine, and to be quite honest I'd prefer it be done my a machine rather than some stinky Mexican!

So there you have it! These cheap a$$ farmers need to invest in some new equipment and send the Mexicans home!

3/19/2017 10:17:58 AM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

mr_bad_robot
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (20,263)
Cincinnati, OH
42, joined Jul. 2014


stellar007

Vineyards require a lot of TLC maintaining the vines. This requires a lot of labor. The larger vineyards use machines to harvest the grapes but still need people to do the grunt work.

Same for commercial tomatoes. They are harvested by machine but farmers bring in workers at harvest to pick up what the harvester missed and for other manual labor that is required.

A commercial tomato farm not too far from me brings in around 100 migrant workers every harvest. The farmers try to share the workers.

3/19/2017 12:23:44 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

stellar007
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (14,387)
Plymouth, MI
42, joined Dec. 2013


It doesn't have to be that way Robot, and while I am no fan of grapes, wine or tomatoes - much could be done to allow a fully automated process however farmers do not want to make the necessary investments to do this. The are well aware that a few hundred Mexicans being paid under the table is still less expensive, plus these farmers really get off on working people like a dog.

3/19/2017 12:34:36 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

trackker
Over 1,000 Posts (1,463)
Vancouver, WA
35, joined May. 2014


they make more money standing at a corner with a sign begging, in addition to their welfare

3/19/2017 12:37:42 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

trackker
Over 1,000 Posts (1,463)
Vancouver, WA
35, joined May. 2014


before NBC became fake news

http://www.cnbc.com/id/49110815

3/19/2017 12:51:43 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

mr_bad_robot
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (20,263)
Cincinnati, OH
42, joined Jul. 2014


Quote from stellar007:
It doesn't have to be that way Robot, and while I am no fan of grapes, wine or tomatoes - much could be done to allow a fully automated process however farmers do not want to make the necessary investments to do this. The are well aware that a few hundred Mexicans being paid under the table is still less expensive, plus these farmers really get off on working people like a dog.


You just have never been around commercial farms.

3/19/2017 2:29:32 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

stellar007
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (14,387)
Plymouth, MI
42, joined Dec. 2013


Oh I sure have... Take a ride thru Nebraska sometime... You could learn something about what it means to be a professional at your trade.

3/19/2017 3:43:41 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  
waltree
Over 1,000 Posts (1,375)
Newton, NC
58, joined Oct. 2013


Wages are only one aspect of "Working For A Living". "BENEFITS!" What About Benefits for the Toothless man; and the Drug addicts?

IT it no wonder; FREE AMERICANS REFUSE To BECOME SLAVES!

3/19/2017 3:45:14 PM Farm Wages Rise: Americans Still Won't Take the Jobs  

stellar007
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (14,387)
Plymouth, MI
42, joined Dec. 2013