5/29/2017 9:44:04 PM |
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blake6972
Bunker Hill, WV
45, joined Jul. 2013
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It isn't the truth.
Meet singles at DateHookup.dating, we're 100% free! Join now!
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5/29/2017 9:46:48 PM |
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sdgncalix3
Palm Bay, FL
44, joined Dec. 2012
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According to you
Sorry,
This isnt the world according to Blake
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5/29/2017 9:50:34 PM |
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blake6972
Bunker Hill, WV
45, joined Jul. 2013
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According to The Truth.
I am but a mere man...
It has nothing to do with me in regards to the true reality of Creationism.
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5/29/2017 9:51:45 PM |
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sdgncalix3
Palm Bay, FL
44, joined Dec. 2012
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the truth
What proves this "Truth" ?
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5/29/2017 9:52:49 PM |
Who designed the human eyeball? | Page 12 |
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blake6972
Bunker Hill, WV
45, joined Jul. 2013
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The truth reveals and exposes.
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5/29/2017 9:53:41 PM |
Who designed the human eyeball? | Page 12 |
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sdgncalix3
Palm Bay, FL
44, joined Dec. 2012
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Creationism ignores the reality of science
Creationists don't understand science.
Neil Degrasse Tyson put it most succinctly: "The good thing about science is that it is true whether or not you believe it.
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5/29/2017 9:54:37 PM |
Who designed the human eyeball? | Page 12 |
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sdgncalix3
Palm Bay, FL
44, joined Dec. 2012
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Reveals what?
Exposes what?
Like I said, What is this "Truth"?
Possible 'chatting' detected. You have already posted in this thread recently. Please wait for some other people to reply before posting in this thread again, or wait like an hour or so, whichever comes first. Sorry for the inconvenience.
This message might annoy you a bit, however we want to make sure more than a couple of people get a chance to respond in a thread. The 'chat' forums and groups don't have this restriction, only a few forums actually have it. You will almost never get this message if you post thoughtful, on-topic replies.
Title: Who designed the human eyeball?
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5/29/2017 9:55:25 PM |
Who designed the human eyeball? | Page 12 |
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blake6972
Bunker Hill, WV
45, joined Jul. 2013
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God is truth.
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5/29/2017 9:59:30 PM |
Who designed the human eyeball? | Page 12 |
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sdgncalix3
Palm Bay, FL
44, joined Dec. 2012
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Who told or taught you that?
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5/29/2017 10:05:46 PM |
Who designed the human eyeball? | Page 12 |
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blake6972
Bunker Hill, WV
45, joined Jul. 2013
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Living
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5/29/2017 10:10:17 PM |
Who designed the human eyeball? | Page 12 |
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sdgncalix3
Palm Bay, FL
44, joined Dec. 2012
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Ok..
Lke I said,
If it works for you, Cool.
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5/30/2017 10:54:10 AM |
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blake6972
Bunker Hill, WV
45, joined Jul. 2013
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Not a matter "if it works for me", it is the way it is.
I have nothing to do with it (creationism) other than utilize what I need to sustain life.
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5/30/2017 11:18:52 AM |
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lordclarence
South Yorkshire
United Kingdom
59, joined Mar. 2013
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.
God is truth.
No, truth is that which can be objectively verified by evidence. This is how we know evolution is true. God/s are unprovable hypothetical counter-intuitive agencies possessing minds but lacking physical bodies. Religionists are often fanatically convinced that God/s exist because they've been indoctrinated by parents or preachers into thinking their (after)lives depend on it.
This sort of thing:
"Nor must we overlook the probability of the constant inculcation in a belief in God on the minds of children producing so strong and perhaps an inherited effect on their brains not yet fully developed, that it would be as difficult for them to throw off their belief in God, as for a monkey to throw off its instinctive fear and hatred of a snake."
~ Charles Darwin
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5/30/2017 11:24:25 AM |
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sdgncalix3
Palm Bay, FL
44, joined Dec. 2012
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Religion makes a virtue out of faith. Trust and obey for there’s no other way to be happy in Jesus. So sing children in Sunday schools across America. The Lord works in mysterious ways, pastors tell believers who have been shaken by horrors like brain cancer or a tsunami. Faith is a virtue.
As science eats away at territory once held by religion, traditional religious beliefs require greater and greater mental defenses against threatening information. To stay strong, religion trains believers to practice self-deception, shut out contradictory evidence, and trust authorities rather than their own capacity to think. This approach seeps into other parts of life. Government, in particular, becomes a fight between competing ideologies rather than a quest to figure out practical, evidence-based solutions that promote wellbeing.
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5/30/2017 11:30:09 AM |
Who designed the human eyeball? | Page 12 |
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blake6972
Bunker Hill, WV
45, joined Jul. 2013
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Overwhelming evidence supports God.
There is NO PROOF of evolution, just certain individuals who want it to be true to fulfill their objectives.
Only a fool says there is no God.
No transitional fossils depicting any form of evolution in any stage.
There would be millions if evolution were true.
No observation from anyone observing evolution in process.
Why?
Because Evolution is a theory only. No facts whatsoever.
Just BS definitions to certain words to fit their narrative, and even then it still fails miserably.
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5/30/2017 11:33:00 AM |
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blake6972
Bunker Hill, WV
45, joined Jul. 2013
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Hey calix why not try to formulate what you know and believe once and awhile, instead of posting other people's material all the time.
And why you are at it, keep shaking your fists at God and mocking Him and His believers.
Because that would make sense.
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5/30/2017 11:50:15 AM |
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sdgncalix3
Palm Bay, FL
44, joined Dec. 2012
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Overwhelming evidence supports God.
There is NO PROOF of evolution, just certain individuals who want it to be true to fulfill their objectives.
Only a fool says there is no God.
No transitional fossils depicting any form of evolution in any stage.
There would be millions if evolution were true.
No observation from anyone observing evolution in process.
Why?
Because Evolution is a theory only. No facts whatsoever.
Just BS definitions to certain words to fit their narrative, and even then it still fails miserably.
What evidence is there of God?
There is proof of evolution
What objectives?
There are plenty of fossils. You just refuse to believe them.
People can believe there is no God. It doesnt make them foolish Why would it?
Scientists have observed evolution .
Its a proven scientific theory.
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5/30/2017 12:16:51 PM |
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lordclarence
South Yorkshire
United Kingdom
59, joined Mar. 2013
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.
Overwhelming evidence supports God.
Feel free to present your evidence. There's no rationing of webspace here.
There is NO PROOF of evolution, just certain individuals who want it to be true to fulfill their objectives.
Are you saying the scientific community are engaged in one of those silly conspiracy theories that certain unhinged American subcultures believe in, like chemtrails, or reptilian alien politicians, or killer vaccines? Surely you must realize this is wrong, and that scientists are in competition to discover the truth about nature. If an individual scientist could disprove evolution, he'd be as famous as Einstein.
Only a fool says there is no God.
Only a fool says evolution isn't true. And if any gods existed who were responsible for designing the workings of nature, they'd agree with modern science - not with you and your silly platitudes.
No transitional fossils depicting any form of evolution in any stage.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_transitional_fossils
There would be millions if evolution were true.
It depends exactly what you mean. Species aren't fixed, so every fossil is transitional between its ancestors and its descendants. The most interesting transitional fossils are those that present a mosaic of characters that appear almost exactly intermediate between the ancestral species and the modern species. A good example might be the australopithecines and modern humans. Australopithecines had bipedality, opposable thumbs, human like small tooth structure, but also small brains. The example I'm posting a pic of here is Australopithecus sediba.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australopithecus_sediba
No observation from anyone observing evolution in process.
Earlier in the thread someone already mentioned Richard Lenski, who has a 20 year+ experiment in progress of studying evolution in E-Coli bacteria. You responded with one of your typical bombastic ignorant posts where you stated that E-Coli isn't a species. But it is. It's a species of bacteria. And humans are related to bacteria, just as we're related to all organisms on earth. So bacteria can be used to study the mechanisms by which evolution operates. A person with the requisite attention span (probably not you) can read about this here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E._coli_long-term_evolution_experiment
Because Evolution is a theory only. No facts whatsoever.
Just BS definitions to certain words to fit their narrative, and even then it still fails miserably.
You are the living embodiment of the word bullshit. The word ought to be your middle name. If you had an enema before you died, the amount of you left for burial would probably be insufficient to fill a matchbox.
Just kidding. Christopher Hitchens said words to that effect about Jerry Falwell. lol emoticon~~>
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5/30/2017 4:22:37 PM |
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fishnthec
Mesquite, TX
65, joined Oct. 2010
online now!
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Science has proven that Democrats did in fact evolve from apes!
Donald Trump has proven, that the Republicans have yet to evolve!
[Edited 5/30/2017 4:23:59 PM ]
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5/30/2017 9:21:35 PM |
Who designed the human eyeball? | Page 12 |
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blake6972
Bunker Hill, WV
45, joined Jul. 2013
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What evidence is there of God?
There is proof of evolution
What objectives?
There are plenty of fossils. You just refuse to believe them.
People can believe there is no God. It doesnt make them foolish Why would it?
Scientists have observed evolution .
Its a proven scientific theory.
Answer to question #1
LIFE
There is no proof of evolution and definitely NO FACTS pertaining to the theory of evolution.
Answer to question #2
There are several , but the main one (which most of the others hinge off) is the promotion of Atheism/Humanism/Naturalism.
There are NO (muchless plenty) of fossils that provide overwhelming evidence (muchless any) of evolution.
So calix , it isn't that I refuse to see or believe that these magic fossils exist, it is simply that THEY DO NOT .
No one said people cannot believe in God, but thanks for the reminder I guess.
If anyone says there is no God , they are absolutely a fool.
God Himself states that truth in His recorded Word that was penned by Holy men , but INSPIRED by God Himself.
For He is not the author of confusion but the giver of clarity.
Scientists have not observed evolution.
You must be thinking of mutation which isn't evolution.
It is not a proven scientific theory at all.
It is a faith based belief however. It is a religion.
There is no REAL scientific evidence that evolution is occurring at present or ever occurred in the past, it is reasonable to conclude that evolution is not a fact of science , as many claim.
In fact , it is not even science at all, but an arbitrary system built upon FAITH in universal naturalism.
[Edited 5/30/2017 9:22:11 PM ]
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5/30/2017 9:31:52 PM |
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sdgncalix3
Palm Bay, FL
44, joined Dec. 2012
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Im going to have to disagree and so would many of the worlds scientists.
I would love to hear you tell this to the people who research and test this stuff every day of their lives.
They would laugh you out of town.
They would show you proof and you would still deny it.
I cant explain this stuff because I didnt study it. Only what I learned years ago and just the little bit of information here and there from random articles and stuff I read.
Life does not prove the existence of GOD
It just doesnt.
It doesnt prove that God doesnt exist either.
You can say and Believe God is the truth all you want. You can tell people that till you are blue in the face. It doesnt change anything.
You discount any information presented to you and say the scientific community are a bunch of frauds.
Not you exact words but they might as well be,
God is still going to let you into heaven if you realize evolution exists.
God will also let you into heaven if you realize the world is older than 10000 years old.
Evolution is not a religion. Thats what you creationist people say to try and put it down.
It takes a lot more faith to believe in this ultimate being that created everything around us.
Except for sin. God didnt create sin and all the bad things. BUt God created everything else.
But God created that things that sin. God would know that these things would sin
So Gods creation is faulty. Gods perfect creations sin.
[Edited 5/30/2017 9:34:06 PM ]
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5/30/2017 10:29:59 PM |
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blake6972
Bunker Hill, WV
45, joined Jul. 2013
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Im going to have to disagree and so would many of the worlds scientists.
I would love to hear you tell this to the people who research and test this stuff every day of their lives.
They would laugh you out of town.
They would show you proof and you would still deny it.
I cant explain this stuff because I didnt study it. Only what I learned years ago and just the little bit of information here and there from random articles and stuff I read.
Life does not prove the existence of GOD
It just doesnt.
It doesnt prove that God doesnt exist either.
You can say and Believe God is the truth all you want. You can tell people that till you are blue in the face. It doesnt change anything.
You discount any information presented to you and say the scientific community are a bunch of frauds.
Not you exact words but they might as well be,
God is still going to let you into heaven if you realize evolution exists.
God will also let you into heaven if you realize the world is older than 10000 years old.
Evolution is not a religion. Thats what you creationist people say to try and put it down.
It takes a lot more faith to believe in this ultimate being that created everything around us.
Except for sin. God didnt create sin and all the bad things. BUt God created everything else.
But God created that things that sin. God would know that these things would sin
So Gods creation is faulty. Gods perfect creations sin.
There are plenty of scientists that would agree 100% with my views and understanding of the topic.
As for your remark that " they would laugh you out of town"...
They most certainly would not.
So you admit that you haven't studied the subject and are limited in your knowledge concerning the subject, but you come off like you know something and I'm clueless.
I have studied both creationism and evolution at length.
I haven't even scratched the surface concerning this discussion.
And yes, life most certainly does prove the existence of God over and over.
For you to say telling people about God won't change a thing is just flat out ridiculous.
I can tell you about many situations/events/people that "changed" after talking about God.
Don't limit God nor underestimate His power.
He controls infinity.
And what authority can you say what God's will is concerning how I may partake in Heaven ?
I ask due to your two mocking comments regarding heaven.
And I see your trying to slip in some of my points such as...
It takes a lot more faith to believe a lie than it does the truth.
God's creation is not faulty.
Don't blame God for freewills course.
It also doesn't matter that God knew sin would be committed, He is omnipotent, you know ...God.
Things don't sin , people sin.
God didn't create people with a sin nature.
He created us with a freewill.
He didn't create emotionless, lifeless robots calix.
He didn't create the choices that people make nor the consequences thereof.
Line upon line,
precept upon precept,
here a little , there a little...
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5/30/2017 10:44:32 PM |
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sdgncalix3
Palm Bay, FL
44, joined Dec. 2012
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Preachy Preachy.
Its exhausting
Like I said,
God knows everything
God knows that with freewill people will sin.
God created people. God created freewill.
People sin because of freewill.
On and on and on and on.
I dont care what you have studied.
You arent an expert on the subject.
I highly doubt you are a scientist.
Yes. There are scientists that believe the way you do.
I would say they are wrong too.
Its not mocking to say God will let you into heaven in you believe in evolution
Thats ike saying god is going to send me to hell for using the word f**k or listening to rock and roll music because it talks about sex and drugs.
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5/30/2017 11:01:35 PM |
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blake6972
Bunker Hill, WV
45, joined Jul. 2013
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WEAK.
Robots don't sin calix.
Why?
You never did answer my question about on what authority...
Preachy? How so?
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5/30/2017 11:04:20 PM |
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jillybodob
Naperville, IL
27, joined Jul. 2013
online now!
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free will. what an interesting notion. what does free will mean cali?
Preachy Preachy.
Its exhausting
Like I said,
God knows everything
God knows that with freewill people will sin.
God created people. God created freewill.
People sin because of freewill.
On and on and on and on.
I dont care what you have studied.
You arent an expert on the subject.
I highly doubt you are a scientist.
Yes. There are scientists that believe the way you do.
I would say they are wrong too.
Its not mocking to say God will let you into heaven in you believe in evolution
Thats ike saying god is going to send me to hell for using the word f**k or listening to rock and roll music because it talks about sex and drugs.
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5/31/2017 12:28:26 AM |
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scarredandtatto
Oral, SD
52, joined Aug. 2013
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dah f**k? !
You ask the stupidest questions. How in the F**K do you not know what free will is?!
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5/31/2017 12:33:12 AM |
Who designed the human eyeball? | Page 12 |
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jillybodob
Naperville, IL
27, joined Jul. 2013
online now!
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Cali brought up free will Scar, not me. And promptly shut up when I questioned on it. Maybe you have some thoughts on it.
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5/31/2017 12:37:43 AM |
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scarredandtatto
Oral, SD
52, joined Aug. 2013
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IDGAF who brought it up, b*tch. You don't know what it is yet you're in here yappin.
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5/31/2017 12:41:40 AM |
Who designed the human eyeball? | Page 12 |
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jillybodob
Naperville, IL
27, joined Jul. 2013
online now!
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Free will is a simple concept Scar. One that I guess scares the hell out of you, yet people exercise such everyday, yet blame such on everyone else but themselves. And you wonder why I bring it up. Your f**king STOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOPID.
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5/31/2017 12:45:23 AM |
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scarredandtatto
Oral, SD
52, joined Aug. 2013
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I see Google worked for you. I'm so proud of you!
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5/31/2017 12:52:25 AM |
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jillybodob
Naperville, IL
27, joined Jul. 2013
online now!
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Google and Facebook only want you to see what they want you to see.
That was not for your Scar, that's for everyone but you, 'cause I doubt you would even remotely get it even I told you.
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5/31/2017 12:55:08 AM |
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scarredandtatto
Oral, SD
52, joined Aug. 2013
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Eh, save your words. IDGAF.
[Edited 5/31/2017 12:55:41 AM ]
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5/31/2017 12:59:01 AM |
Who designed the human eyeball? | Page 12 |
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jillybodob
Naperville, IL
27, joined Jul. 2013
online now!
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Video will play after this ad? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tBHQIq9OGDY
Or maybe your just blind.
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5/31/2017 1:06:59 AM |
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scarredandtatto
Oral, SD
52, joined Aug. 2013
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No, seriously! IDGAF.
like I'm going to watch some wanky video on YouTube from you.
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5/31/2017 1:10:29 AM |
Who designed the human eyeball? | Page 12 |
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jillybodob
Naperville, IL
27, joined Jul. 2013
online now!
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Video will play after this ad.
I don't give a f**k what you think Scar.
Nickleback...let it play...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lrXIQQ8PeRs
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5/31/2017 1:23:45 AM |
Who designed the human eyeball? | Page 12 |
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jillybodob
Naperville, IL
27, joined Jul. 2013
online now!
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Net neutrality, defined by who, Facebook and Google?
Think about it for a minute, net neutrality? Gov't has to intercede to make what already is possible, possible? Do you really believe that shit?
Google and Facebook only want you to see what they want you to see.
That was not for your Scar, that's for everyone but you, 'cause I doubt you would even remotely get it even I told you.
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6/4/2017 12:01:39 PM |
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lordclarence
South Yorkshire
United Kingdom
59, joined Mar. 2013
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.
No transitional fossils depicting any form of evolution in any stage.
This is part of a BBC series about unusually well preserved caches of fossils that deliver reams of information about the natural world's evolutionary past. This episode is about birds, and the remarkable fossils that have emerged in recent years in Liaoning Province, China, that illustrate how dinosaurs transitioned into birds. I chanced upon a repeat of this programme a few days ago and was as entranced as if it was the first time I'd seen it. Which makes me lament the shortcomings of human memory, because I've seen it before.
Anyway here you are. I'm bumping your shitty ignoramus favouring thread. You can make the usual soundbite dismissive statements or watch and learn. The choice is yours.
https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1xhfpz_fossil-wonderlands-natures-hidden-treasures-feathered-dinosaurs-2-of-3_tv
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6/9/2017 7:54:57 PM |
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blake6972
Bunker Hill, WV
45, joined Jul. 2013
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I don't need to watch your BS silly fairytale videos lordfullofsh#$.
Apparently it is you who is ignorant.
It takes a whole lot of faith to adhere to your wacky religion.
No scientists have EVER observed anything evolve .
There are NO FACTS concerning evilution. NONE.
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6/10/2017 9:39:01 AM |
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lordclarence
South Yorkshire
United Kingdom
59, joined Mar. 2013
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Quote from blake:
Okay, have it your way but if you ever evolve beyond the truculent denialist toddler stage you'll find the TV documentary reveals some fine evidence for the evolution of birds. It's part of a trilogy all about fossil evidence.
Here's some info that shouldn't be too taxing on the ol' attention span:
Weird Wonders
Professor Richard Fortey journeys high in the Rocky Mountains to explore a 520-million-year-old fossilised seabed containing bizarre and experimental lifeforms that have revolutionised our understanding about the beginnings of complex life. Among the amazing finds he uncovers are marine creatures with five eyes and a proboscis; filter-feeders shaped like tulips; worm-like scavengers covered in spikes but with no identifiable head or anus; and a metre-long predator resembling a giant shrimp.
Feathered Dinosaurs
Professor Richard Fortey travels to northeastern China to see a fossil site known as the 'Dinosaur Pompeii' - a place that has yielded spectacular remains of feathered dinosaurs and rewritten the story of the origins of birds. Among the amazing finds he investigates are the feathered cousin of T-rex, a feathered dinosaur with strong parallels to living pandas and some of the most remarkable flying animals that have ever lived.
The Mammal Hothouse
Professor Richard Fortey investigates the remains of ancient volcanic lake in Germany where stunningly well-preserved fossils of early mammals, giant insects and even perhaps our oldest known ancestor have been found. Among the amazing finds are bats as advanced and sophisticated as anything living today, more than 50-million-years-later; dog-sized 'Dawn' horses, the ancestor of the modern horse; and giant ants as large as a hummingbird.
http://docuwiki.net/index.php?title=Fossil_wonderlands:_nature%27s_hidden_treasures
[Edited 6/10/2017 9:39:54 AM ]
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6/10/2017 2:51:20 PM |
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blake6972
Bunker Hill, WV
45, joined Jul. 2013
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And I win.
I knew you would come around .
I broke you boy.
Evolution is a faith based religion.
PERIOD.
Your lies and immaturity will not change that fact.
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6/10/2017 2:57:19 PM |
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lordclarence
South Yorkshire
United Kingdom
59, joined Mar. 2013
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When do you think modern species were created in their present form with no evolutionary changes from previous forms, and what is your evidence?
[Edited 6/10/2017 2:58:53 PM ]
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6/10/2017 3:02:46 PM |
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scarredandtatto
Oral, SD
52, joined Aug. 2013
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Hey, ask flakeyboi if God created everything, ask him why he created pain and suffering.
I would but I can't dumb it down enough for him to understand it.
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6/10/2017 3:09:05 PM |
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blake6972
Bunker Hill, WV
45, joined Jul. 2013
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Hey, ask flakeyboi if God created everything, ask him why he created pain and suffering.
I would but I can't dumb it down enough for him to understand it.
You have anything on the topic?
Ever?
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6/10/2017 3:13:10 PM |
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scarredandtatto
Oral, SD
52, joined Aug. 2013
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see
I told ya.
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6/10/2017 3:16:57 PM |
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blake6972
Bunker Hill, WV
45, joined Jul. 2013
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Didn't think so.
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6/10/2017 3:23:19 PM |
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scarredandtatto
Oral, SD
52, joined Aug. 2013
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Hey, cum dumpster, if God created everything, why did He create pain and suffering.
And you STILL haven't answered my question based on a statement made by you.
WHAT'S AHMAATAH? Can't? !
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6/10/2017 3:45:44 PM |
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lordclarence
South Yorkshire
United Kingdom
59, joined Mar. 2013
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.
When do you think modern species were created in their present form with no evolutionary changes from previous forms, and what is your evidence?
Due to the lack of intelligent responses and the profusion of empty soundbite grade bombast, I'm doubtful that the creator of this mindless thread knows enough about either his culturally inherited fundamentalist Christian prejudices or the scientific evidence for evolution to say anything relevant about the thread topic as stated.
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6/10/2017 5:00:16 PM |
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blake6972
Bunker Hill, WV
45, joined Jul. 2013
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.
When do you think modern species were created in their present form with no evolutionary changes from previous forms, and what is your evidence?
Due to the lack of intelligent responses and the profusion of empty soundbite grade bombast, I'm doubtful that the creator of this mindless thread knows enough about either his culturally inherited fundamentalist Christian prejudices or the scientific evidence for evolution to say anything relevant about the thread topic as stated.
Clarence you are a fool.
There is NO EVIDENCE that proves evolution.
It is a faith based theory.
A religion created by man NOT GOD.
You will not attract me towards your vinegar.
Throughout many threads including this one I have presented a great case for Creationism and God as the creator.
You are a mocker and scoffer.
The Word of God warns about people like you.
You are a hateful, bitter, Godless fool who ask silly questions that just leads to more silliness.
That is to be avoided.
Stop acting like you know something when clearly you do not.
I didn't inherit any Christian fundamental prejudices.
That is you just passing unfounded rubbish as usual.
I give God glory, you spit in His face and mock Him simultaneously while you reject Him.
Why yes, you are definitely quite the fool.
So be it Clarence.
You will confess The Lord Jesus Christ , that I promise.
Everyone will believe .
But, by all means continue to prance around like an effeminate fool .
Atheism will NOT redeem you.
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6/10/2017 5:10:05 PM |
Who designed the human eyeball? | Page 12 |
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scarredandtatto
Oral, SD
52, joined Aug. 2013
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Flakyboy You
Are
A c*nt.
Where
Are your
Responses
To my
Questions
?B*tch
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6/11/2017 7:35:00 AM |
Who designed the human eyeball? | Page 12 |
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blake6972
Bunker Hill, WV
45, joined Jul. 2013
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What was your response to the threads question Scaredofvaginas2 ?
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