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3/6/2016 8:02:18 PM |
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cupocheer
Assumption, IL
68, joined May. 2010
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Christian by the Grace of God.
Meet singles at DateHookup.dating, we're 100% free! Join now!
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3/6/2016 8:02:19 PM |
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lmarcox2
Antonio de BiedmaMexico City
Mexico
33, joined Jun. 2015
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continuation:
10. The Future
195:10.1 (2084.1) Christianity has indeed done a great service for this world, but what is now most needed is Jesus. The world needs to see Jesus living again on earth in the experience of spirit-born mortals who effectively reveal the Master to all men. It is futile to talk about a revival of primitive Christianity; you must go forward from where you find yourselves. Modern culture must become spiritually baptized with a new revelation of Jesus’ life and illuminated with a new understanding of his gospel of eternal salvation. And when Jesus becomes thus lifted up, he will draw all men to himself. Jesus’ disciples should be more than conquerors, even overflowing sources of inspiration and enhanced living to all men. Religion is only an exalted humanism until it is made divine by the discovery of the reality of the presence of God in personal experience.
195:10.2 (2084.2) The beauty and sublimity, the humanity and divinity, the simplicity and uniqueness, of Jesus’ life on earth present such a striking and appealing picture of man-saving and God-revealing that the theologians and philosophers of all time should be effectively restrained from daring to form creeds or create theological systems of spiritual bondage out of such a transcendental bestowal of God in the form of man. In Jesus the universe produced a mortal man in whom the spirit of love triumphed over the material handicaps of time and overcame the fact of physical origin.
195:10.3 (2084.3) Ever bear in mind — God and men need each other. They are mutually necessary to the full and final attainment of eternal personality experience in the divine destiny of universe finality.
195:10.4 (2084.4) “The kingdom of God is within you” was probably the greatest pronouncement Jesus ever made, next to the declaration that his Father is a living and loving spirit.
195:10.5 (2084.5) In winning souls for the Master, it is not the first mile of compulsion, duty, or convention that will transform man and his world, but rather the second mile of free service and liberty-loving devotion that betokens the Jesusonian reaching forth to grasp his brother in love and sweep him on under spiritual guidance toward the higher and divine goal of mortal existence. Christianity even now willingly goes the first mile, but mankind languishes and stumbles along in moral darkness because there are so few genuine second-milers — so few professed followers of Jesus who really live and love as he taught his disciples to live and love and serve.
195:10.6 (2084.6) The call to the adventure of building a new and transformed human society by means of the spiritual rebirth of Jesus’ brotherhood of the kingdom should thrill all who believe in him as men have not been stirred since the days when they walked about on earth as his companions in the flesh.
195:10.7 (2084.7) No social system or political regime which denies the reality of God can contribute in any constructive and lasting manner to the advancement of human civilization. But Christianity, as it is subdivided and secularized today, presents the greatest single obstacle to its further advancement; especially is this true concerning the Orient.
195:10.8 (2084.8) Ecclesiasticism is at once and forever incompatible with that living faith, growing spirit, and firsthand experience of the faith-comrades of Jesus in the brotherhood of man in the spiritual association of the kingdom of heaven. The praiseworthy desire to preserve traditions of past achievement often leads to the defense of outgrown systems of worship. The well-meant desire to foster ancient thought systems effectually prevents the sponsoring of new and adequate means and methods designed to satisfy the spiritual longings of the expanding and advancing minds of modern men. Likewise, the Christian churches of the twentieth century stand as great, but wholly unconscious, obstacles to the immediate advance of the real gospel — the teachings of Jesus of Nazareth.
195:10.9 (2085.1) Many earnest persons who would gladly yield loyalty to the Christ of the gospel find it very difficult enthusiastically to support a church which exhibits so little of the spirit of his life and teachings, and which they have been erroneously taught he founded. Jesus did not found the so-called Christian church, but he has, in every manner consistent with his nature, fostered it as the best existent exponent of his lifework on earth.
195:10.10 (2085.2) If the Christian church would only dare to espouse the Master’s program, thousands of apparently indifferent youths would rush forward to enlist in such a spiritual undertaking, and they would not hesitate to go all the way through with this great adventure.
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3/6/2016 8:02:58 PM |
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lmarcox2
Antonio de BiedmaMexico City
Mexico
33, joined Jun. 2015
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195:10.11 (2085.3) Christianity is seriously confronted with the doom embodied in one of its own slogans: “A house divided against itself cannot stand.” The non-Christian world will hardly capitulate to a sect-divided Christendom. The living Jesus is the only hope of a possible unification of Christianity. The true church — the Jesus brotherhood — is invisible, spiritual, and is characterized by unity, not necessarily by uniformity. Uniformity is the earmark of the physical world of mechanistic nature. Spiritual unity is the fruit of faith union with the living Jesus. The visible church should refuse longer to handicap the progress of the invisible and spiritual brotherhood of the kingdom of God. And this brotherhood is destined to become a living organism in contrast to an institutionalized social organization. It may well utilize such social organizations, but it must not be supplanted by them.
195:10.12 (2085.4) But the Christianity of even the twentieth century must not be despised. It is the product of the combined moral genius of the God-knowing men of many races during many ages, and it has truly been one of the greatest powers for good on earth, and therefore no man should lightly regard it, notwithstanding its inherent and acquired defects. Christianity still contrives to move the minds of reflective men with mighty moral emotions.
195:10.13 (2085.5) But there is no excuse for the involvement of the church in commerce and politics; such unholy alliances are a flagrant betrayal of the Master. And the genuine lovers of truth will be slow to forget that this powerful institutionalized church has often dared to smother newborn faith and persecute truth bearers who chanced to appear in unorthodox raiment.
195:10.14 (2085.6) It is all too true that such a church would not have survived unless there had been men in the world who preferred such a style of worship. Many spiritually indolent souls crave an ancient and authoritative religion of ritual and sacred traditions. Human evolution and spiritual progress are hardly sufficient to enable all men to dispense with religious authority. And the invisible brotherhood of the kingdom may well include these family groups of various social and temperamental classes if they are only willing to become truly spirit-led sons of God. But in this brotherhood of Jesus there is no place for sectarian rivalry, group bitterness, nor assertions of moral superiority and spiritual infallibility.
195:10.15 (2086.1) These various groupings of Christians may serve to accommodate numerous different types of would-be believers among the various peoples of Western civilization, but such division of Christendom presents a grave weakness when it attempts to carry the gospel of Jesus to Oriental peoples. These races do not yet understand that there is a religion of Jesus separate, and somewhat apart, from Christianity, which has more and more become a religion about Jesus.
195:10.16 (2086.2) The great hope of Urantia lies in the possibility of a new revelation of Jesus with a new and enlarged presentation of his saving message which would spiritually unite in loving service the numerous families of his present-day professed followers.
195:10.17 (2086.3) Even secular education could help in this great spiritual renaissance if it would pay more attention to the work of teaching youth how to engage in life planning and character progression. The purpose of all education should be to foster and further the supreme purpose of life, the development of a majestic and well-balanced personality. There is great need for the teaching of moral discipline in the place of so much self-gratification. Upon such a foundation religion may contribute its spiritual incentive to the enlargement and enrichment of mortal life, even to the security and enhancement of life eternal.
195:10.18 (2086.4) Christianity is an extemporized religion, and therefore must it operate in low gear. High-gear spiritual performances must await the new revelation and the more general acceptance of the real religion of Jesus. But Christianity is a mighty religion, seeing that the commonplace disciples of a crucified carpenter set in motion those teachings which conquered the Roman world in three hundred years and then went on to triumph over the barbarians who overthrew Rome. This same Christianity conquered — absorbed and exalted — the whole stream of Hebrew theology and Greek philosophy. And then, when this Christian religion became comatose for more than a thousand years as a result of an overdose of mysteries and paganism, it resurrected itself and virtually reconquered the whole Western world. Christianity contains enough of Jesus’ teachings to immortalize it.
195:10.19 (2086.5) If Christianity could only grasp more of Jesus’ teachings, it could do so much more in helping modern man to solve his new and increasingly complex problems.
195:10.20 (2086.6) Christianity suffers under a great handicap because it has become identified in the minds of all the world as a part of the social system, the industrial life, and the moral standards of Western civilization; and thus has Christianity unwittingly seemed to sponsor a society which staggers under the guilt of tolerating science without idealism, politics without principles, wealth without work, pleasure without restraint, knowledge without character, power without conscience, and industry without morality.
195:10.21 (2086.7) The hope of modern Christianity is that it should cease to sponsor the social systems and industrial policies of Western civilization while it humbly bows itself before the cross it so valiantly extols, there to learn anew from Jesus of Nazareth the greatest truths mortal man can ever hear — the living gospel of the fatherhood of God and the brotherhood of man.
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3/7/2016 12:12:14 AM |
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ludlowlowell
Panama City, FL
64, joined Feb. 2008
online now!
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By remaining outside the One True Church, non-Catholic Christians contribute to the disunity of Christianity.
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3/7/2016 2:15:32 AM |
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followjesusonly
Kingman, AZ
74, joined May. 2012
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A question about the 700,000 creator-sons---did they exist from all eternity, or did God create them at some point in time?
I answered this on the other thread. Let me know if you don't find it.
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3/7/2016 2:29:48 AM |
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followjesusonly
Kingman, AZ
74, joined May. 2012
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By remaining outside the One True Church, non-Catholic Christians contribute to the disunity of Christianity.
The One True Church is the the spiritual brotherhood of all believers. No Christians are outside of it. But you're right, it is rife with disunity. And that's the fault of your church, its insufferability and intransigence, scandals, corruption, etc., it drove people away. You killed the goose that laid the Golden Egg and you (your church) proved the adage that "Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely." On the other hand, the failure of Christianity as evidenced by its disunity provides a wonderful opening for God's new revelation, The Urantia Book. The "rock" that Jesus founded his church upon, the spiritual brotherhood of all believers, was the group exclamation by the Apostles that Jesus was the Son of God.
Mat 16:15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
Mat 16:16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
Mat 16:17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
That was the "rock," the profession by the Apostles of Jesus' divinity.
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3/7/2016 4:57:12 AM |
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ludlowlowell
Panama City, FL
64, joined Feb. 2008
online now!
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Was Arius correct?
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3/7/2016 6:50:49 AM |
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bigd9832
Chicago, IL
64, joined Oct. 2007
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By remaining outside the One True Church, non-Catholic Christians contribute to the disunity of Christianity.
Neither ludlow nor any other Catholic can tell you what the true church is. that must come from within. The answer can be different for each one.
The Catholic church is corrupt.
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3/7/2016 12:58:37 PM |
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followjesusonly
Kingman, AZ
74, joined May. 2012
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Was Arius correct?
Who are you asking?
Refresh me on Arius please.
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3/7/2016 1:53:22 PM |
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followjesusonly
Kingman, AZ
74, joined May. 2012
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OK, I Googled it to refresh my memory.
Wikipedia says:
Although virtually all positive writings on Arius' theology have been suppressed or destroyed[citation needed], negative writings describe Arius' theology as one in which there was a time before the Son of God, when only God the Father existed. Despite concerted opposition, 'Arian' Christian churches persisted throughout Europe, the Middle East, and North Africa, and also in various Gothic and Germanic kingdoms, until suppressed by military conquest or voluntary royal conversion between the fifth and seventh centuries.
Isn't that the way of the world, if someone doesn't agree with you, you suppress or destroy them and their ideas or kill them? That's really not a good solution to human dissent.
So the issue is that God preceded Jesus?
Wikipedia-
The Arian controversy was in reality a series of controversies, related to Christology, that arose between Arius, a priest and theologian, and Bishop Athanasius, a Church Father. The most important of these controversies concerned the substantial relationship between God the Father and Jesus Christ. These disagreements divided the Church into two opposing theological factions for over 55 years, from the time before the Council of Nicaea in 325 until after the Council of Constantinople in 381. There was no formal resolution or formal schism; the Catholic church eventually formed its own theology on this matter.
Arius made the following syllogism: he said, "If the Father begat the Son, he that was begotten had a beginning of existence: and from this it is evident, that there was a time when the Son was not. It therefore necessarily follows, that he had his substance from nothing".
Is that the issue? Well, Arius' logic seems to be good, doesn't it? If you beget someone, you came first before what you begat.
I would say that's probably and apparently true for Jesus/Michael, the Creator Son, but perhaps not true for the Eternal Son who is truly part of the Trinity, as per The Urantia Book anyway.
But none of this matters to one's salvation.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arian_controversy
This is quite a good article above.
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3/7/2016 1:53:37 PM |
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ludlowlowell
Panama City, FL
64, joined Feb. 2008
online now!
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I was asking FJO. Google Arius and see what comes up---he was very famous (infamous?) in his day---fourth century a.d.
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3/7/2016 4:26:24 PM |
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followjesusonly
Kingman, AZ
74, joined May. 2012
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I was asking FJO. Google Arius and see what comes up---he was very famous (infamous?) in his day---fourth century a.d.
Yeah, I Googled it an my comments are right above your post.
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3/14/2016 4:46:09 PM |
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prophetic774
Winter Haven, FL
66, joined Feb. 2011
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IS THE FIRST 1,000 YEAR RESURRECTION IN REVELATION 20:4-6 FOR MARTYRS LIKE JESUS AND THE 24 ELDERS ON THRONES WITH AUTHORITY TO JUDGE ONLY??
According to Revelation 20:4-6 there will be *TWO* Resurrections. The 1st continuous 1,000 year Heavenly Resurrection is for the 24 Elders on thrones and *MARTYRS* LIKE JESUS ONLY* and will end at the 2nd coming of Jesus when the 2nd Resurrection will take place for the saints of all ages who are *NOT MARTYRS*!!
In Daniel 12:2 just after the Great Tribulation we read, "Multitudes who SLEEP in the dust of the earth will *AWAKE*, some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt.
I Thess 5:10: He {Jesus} died for us so that, whether we are AWAKE {Martyrs} or asleep, we may live together with Him. The martyrs who are *AWAKE* with Jesus will also receive their new heavenly bodies at the 2nd coming of Jesus as per I Corinthians 15:51,52: Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all *SLEEP* but we will all be changed--in a flash, in a twinkling of an eye, at the Last {7TH} Trumpet!!
There are only TWO RESURRECTIONS for all saints mentioned in Rev 20:4-6: The FIRST RESURRECTION is for MARTYRS AND THE 24 ELDERS ONLY and INCLUDES the Tribulation Martyrs. And therefore the SECOND RESURRECTION must come on the Last Day of the Great Tribulation and must include ALL SAINTS {Both OT & NT} who are not martyrs or the 24 Elders on thrones.
The Heavenly rewards for the faithful and courageous *MARTYRS* is one of the most important central themes in the book of Revelation. For they will reign with Jesus in Heaven during the 1,000 years before His 2nd Coming; and according to Revelation 7:14-17: They are before the Throne of God and God will spread His tent over them. They will receive White Robes washed in the blood of the Lamb. Never again will they hunger or thirst and God Himself will wipe every tear from their eyes. Jesus will be their Shepherd and will lead them to springs of Living Water.
FOR EXAMPLE: Let us suppose that the SECOND RESURRECTION takes place on September 17th; 2019 then the continuous 1,000 year FIRST RESURRECTION for MARTYRS AND 24 ELDERS ONLY would take place from September 17th, AD 1019 to September 17th, 2019. The 24 Elders and all of the OT & NT saints martyred before September 17th, 1019 were awakened to reign with Jesus in Heaven and every Martyr martyred after September 17th, 1019 were and will be immediately awakened to reign with Jesus in the continuous 1,000 year FIRST RESURRECTION to be completed on September 17th, 2019 at the SECOND RESURRECTION when "The rest of the dead come to life when the thousand years are ENDED." {Rev 20:5a}
Rev 20:4b “I saw the *SOULS of those who had been martyred because of their testimony for Jesus... they came to life and reigned with Christ for 1,000 years. The Martyrs SOULS will only get their New Heavenly bodies when the 1,000 years are ENDED at the 2nd Coming of Jesus.
This seems to contradict John 6:40: Jesus says, “EVERYONE who looks to the Son and believes in Him shall have eternal life and I will raise him up at the LAST DAY.” HOWEVER, the LAST DAY RESURRECTION could last 1,000 years for in 2 Pet 3:8 we read: “With the Lord a DAY is like 1,000 years, and 1,000 years are like a DAY!!
We see the martyrs talking in heaven at the beginning of the Great Tribulation in Revelation 6:9-11 and then we see a great multitude of martyrs who have come out of the Great Tribulation from every nation and language awake in heaven just before the first 7 trumpet plagues in Revelation 7:9-17.
And then just before the last 7 bowl plagues we see martyrs in heaven singing the song of the Lamb in Revelation 15:2-4: And then we see 144,000 Jewish martyrs in heaven with Jesus BEFORE Rome or Babylon is destroyed in Rev 14:8 in Revlation 14:1-5:
Revelation 6:9-11: When He {Jesus} opened the 5th seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God and the testimony they had maintained. They called out in a loud voice, How long, Sovereign Lord, holy and true, until you judge the inhabitants of the earth and avenge our blood? Then each of them were given a WHITE ROBE, and they were told to wait a little longer, until the number of their fellow servants and brothers who were to be killed {Tribulation martyrs} as they had been was completed.
Revelation 7:9,10,13-15,17: After this I looked and there before me was a great multitude that no one could count, from EVERY nation, tribe, people and language standing before the throne and in front of the Lamb {Jesus} They were wearing WHITE ROBES and were holding..And they cried out in a loud voice, "Salvation belongs to our God, who sits on the throne , and to the Lamb...Then one of the {24} elders asked me, "Those in WHITE ROBES--who are they, and where did they come from?" And he said, "They are they who have come out of the *GREAT TRIBULATION*, they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. Therefore, They are before the throne of God and serve Him day and night in His temple...The Lamb in the center of the throne will be their Shepherd!"
Revelation 15:2,3: And I saw..those who had been victorious over the Beast {666} and his image and the number of his name {Tribulation Martyrs}. They held harps given them by God and sang the song of Moses the servant of God and the song of the Lamb: "Great and marvelous are your deeds, Lord God Almighty. Just and true are your ways, King of the ages..." Note: Mount Zion is another name for heaven as per Hebrews 12:22}
Revelation 14:1-4: Then I looked, an there before me was the Lamb, standing on Mount Zion, and with Him 144,000 {See Rev 7:3-8}...And I heard a sound from Heaven...And they sang a new song before the throne. No one could learn the song except the 144,000 who had been REDEEMED from the earth...They follow the Lamb wherever He goes.
The 24 Elders on thrones are mentioned many times in Revelation 4:4,10; 5:5,6,8,11,14; 7:11,13; 11:16-18; 14:3 and 19:4 The 24 Elders on thrones are mentioned many times speaking from heaven during the Great Tribulation and are the only saints mentioned in heaven during the Great Tribulation besides the MARTYRS!!
It is completely obvious that the continuous 1,000 year reign mentioned in Revelation 20:4-6 is for 24 ELDERS on Thrones and MARTYRS ONLY according to God's Word in Revelation 20:4,5: "I saw Thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to JUDGE and I saw the SOULS of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony for Jesus {NT Martyrs}and because of the word of God {OT Martyrs}. They had not worshiped the beast and had not received his mark on their foreheads or their hands {Tribulation Martyrs}. They came to life and rigned with Christ a thousand years. The rest of the dead {Saints who were not martyrs or the 24 elders}did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. {At the 2nd coming of Jesus}
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