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12/27/2015 11:02:00 AM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

duchessa
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (39,656)
Yonkers, NY
63, joined Aug. 2008


Quote from ludlowlowell:
Asanb, the Bible gets its moral authority from the Catholic Church,


I wish I had taken a pic of Pope Francis when he was only a Jesuit priest and playing soccer in my town's summer resort; his Brazilian tanga didn't leave anything to the other "guys'" imagination.

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12/27/2015 11:12:29 AM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

wayn49
Over 2,000 Posts (3,922)
Birmingham, AL
54, joined Feb. 2011


here is a logically response to all the remarks, i am a believer and there are millions who also believe and so many who risk there life for the sake of the gospel. there has been many who walked away from everything and went into the mission field knowing they may not ever return because they believe in this God who is going to return to deliver his people. and most of them are sane and real people that have a love for God and others. but if you compare the unbelievers to the believers Jesus said this


8 I tell you that he will avenge them speedily. Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth? Luke 18: 8

and with God all things are possible and that is why all those stories are real. let me ask you this, who is going to get the last laugh? or the last cry? all the ones who did not believe.

what do you have to lose, nothing but being converted into a believe has to come naturally because you cannot make others believe

12/27/2015 11:25:19 AM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

sail_dancer
Over 7,500 Posts!! (8,520)
Saint Petersburg, FL
68, joined Apr. 2010


Quote from wayn49:
.... with God all things are possible and that is why all those stories are real. let me ask you this, who is going to get the last laugh? or the last cry? all the ones who did not believe.


This is one of the first things you should talk about when you consult a licensed mental health professional.

Peace

12/27/2015 12:24:55 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

duchessa
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (39,656)
Yonkers, NY
63, joined Aug. 2008


Quote from sail_dancer:
This is one of the first things you should talk about when you consult a licensed mental health professional.

Peace




12/27/2015 12:31:38 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

ludlowlowell
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Duchessa, just because Francis is not a very good pope doesn't mean that Jesus isn't the Son of God and the Savior of the world, or that the Catholic Church isn't the one true Church. The Church has had bad popes before and survived.

12/27/2015 12:37:02 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

wayn49
Over 2,000 Posts (3,922)
Birmingham, AL
54, joined Feb. 2011


Quote from sail_dancer:
This is one of the first things you should talk about when you consult a licensed mental health professional.

Peace



thanks and when you see Jesus coming again i hope you believe then

12/27/2015 1:19:24 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

sail_dancer
Over 7,500 Posts!! (8,520)
Saint Petersburg, FL
68, joined Apr. 2010


Quote from ludlowlowell:
just because Francis is not a very good pope


I thought he had a very large following ..... he certainly draws a crowd wherever he goes.

Peace

12/27/2015 3:02:25 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

duchessa
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (39,656)
Yonkers, NY
63, joined Aug. 2008


Quote from ludlowlowell:
Duchessa, just because Francis is not a very good pope doesn't mean that Jesus isn't the Son of God and the Savior of the world, or that the Catholic Church isn't the one true Church. The Church has had bad popes before and survived.


Darling, Francis may end up being the best the church ever got...I was referring at his personal inclinations.

12/27/2015 3:04:51 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

duchessa
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (39,656)
Yonkers, NY
63, joined Aug. 2008


Quote from wayn49:
thanks and when you see Jesus coming again i hope you believe then


See, guy....that's the point: We don't believe he exists because we never saw him...is kind of difficult to believe in something/somebody that nobody ever saw because a bunch of you guys say "it's for real."

12/27/2015 3:42:52 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

ludlowlowell
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The whole idea of faith is that we believe, even though we have not seen.

Why do we believe? We believe because we recognize that Jesus taught the truth. Every sincere lover of truth will be drawn to Jesus.

12/27/2015 3:53:48 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

aphrodisianus
Over 1,000 Posts (1,600)
Leander, TX
66, joined Oct. 2013


Quote from ludlowlowell:
The whole idea of faith is that we believe, even though we have not seen.

Why do we believe? We believe because we recognize that Jesus taught the truth. Every sincere lover of truth will be drawn to Jesus.


Which in essence means people of faith are plain stupid. You don't need an high IQ to have faith. Faith works best when you have a low IQ because a thinking mind is faith's worst enemy. Stupidity and faith are good friends.

12/27/2015 4:02:58 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

duchessa
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (39,656)
Yonkers, NY
63, joined Aug. 2008


Quote from ludlowlowell:
The whole idea of faith is that we believe, even though we have not seen.
.


Which I think is as stupid as stupid does.

12/27/2015 6:38:34 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

ludlowlowell
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I never saw George Washington, Julius Caesar, William the Conqueror, Cleopatra, or Tecumseh either, but I believe they lived and that historical reports about them are at least mostly true. So why is believing in Jesus Christ unreasonable?

12/27/2015 7:07:01 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

aphrodisianus
Over 1,000 Posts (1,600)
Leander, TX
66, joined Oct. 2013


It's a known fact that those who are more religious have a lower IQ. The studies show this. You have to be stupid to believe in nonsense and have no logical and rational thinking processes. Lacking logic and reason is the definition of stupidity.



[Edited 12/27/2015 7:07:55 PM ]

12/27/2015 7:28:36 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

sail_dancer
Over 7,500 Posts!! (8,520)
Saint Petersburg, FL
68, joined Apr. 2010


Quote from ludlowlowell:
I never saw George Washington, Julius Caesar, William the Conqueror, Cleopatra, or Tecumseh either, but I believe they lived and that historical reports about them are at least mostly true. So why is believing in Jesus Christ unreasonable?


You can check this out if you don't believe it.

Do a google search for each name you provided in your post.

What do you think you find?

Here is what you find for George Washington:
George Washington

1st U.S. President

George Washington was the first President of the United States, the Commander-in-Chief of the Continental Army during the American Revolutionary War, and one of the Founding Fathers of the United States. Wikipedia

Born: February 22, 1732, Westmoreland County, Virginia, VA

Died: December 14, 1799, Mount Vernon, VA

Vice president: John Adams (1789–1797)

Spouse: Martha Washington (m. 1759–1799)

Quotes

Be courteous to all, but intimate with few; and let those few be well tried before you give them your confidence.

If the freedom of speech is taken away then dumb and silent we may be led, like sheep to the slaughter.

Observe good faith and justice toward all nations. Cultivate peace and harmony with all.


I would show the rest but the post would exceed limits.

I suggest you do google searches for each of the other names (use names only).

Leave Jesus for last.

Guess what ..... every one of the names have a similar biography except Jesus ..... he is the only one that does not have a biography ..... I wonder why?

I guess you have to have important info like birth and death dates ..... and no one could provide that information about Jesus.

Lets face it ..... there is not enough concrete historic information about Jesus to even write a biography on him ..... only myths exist about a storybook character named Jesus.

Peace

12/27/2015 7:28:55 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

ludlowlowell
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My IQ was measured at 121. Is that too low for you?

12/27/2015 7:38:34 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

aphrodisianus
Over 1,000 Posts (1,600)
Leander, TX
66, joined Oct. 2013


Go see a psychologist for an evaluation. Your delusions will be assessed too.

12/28/2015 3:27:28 AM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

sail_dancer
Over 7,500 Posts!! (8,520)
Saint Petersburg, FL
68, joined Apr. 2010


Quote from ludlowlowell:
My IQ was measured at 121. Is that too low for you?


There is more to "knowledge" and "wisdom" than simply IQ scores, Lud. But focusing on IQ is a good place to start.

You should look into the personality trait known as "openness to experience" and how it can affect knowledge and wisdom. That is why there are some (not many) with high IQ's that still believe in religious nonsense.

Do some research in this area ..... you might learn something ..... and ..... increase your knowledge and wisdom.

Peace

12/28/2015 7:37:42 AM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

duchessa
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (39,656)
Yonkers, NY
63, joined Aug. 2008


Quote from ludlowlowell:
I never saw George Washington, Julius Caesar, William the Conqueror, Cleopatra, or Tecumseh either, but I believe they lived and that historical reports about them are at least mostly true. So why is believing in Jesus Christ unreasonable?


And I didn't see Napoleon, Ranbidranath Tagore, Gral. San Martín, Alexander the Great, the Genghis Khan, Henry the VIII, Sigmund Freud, Safo, Nero or many others whom not only were seen by millions of people BUT their works and achievement were witnessed / recorded by mankind.lud, you are talking about an entity that nobody...ever... saw.
Can you appreciate the difference?

Another detail...if your Jesus were to be real he wouldn't be the blond / blue eyed dude portrayed by the church....because, lud, in the region were he -supposedly- was born people were from the "dark persuasion".

12/28/2015 7:39:38 AM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

duchessa
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (39,656)
Yonkers, NY
63, joined Aug. 2008


Quote from ludlowlowell:
My IQ was measured at 121. Is that too low for you?


How much did you give to the "tester"? LOL

12/28/2015 8:07:23 AM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

jester0011
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (28,799)
Lake Waccamaw, NC
48, joined Jun. 2014


u will find mistakes all denominations make,i just see what the bible says about the one world church and looks like the caths,will be the one because they have a pope

12/28/2015 10:00:10 AM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

ludlowlowell
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How much did I give to the tester, Duchessa asks, referring to my IQ score. I gave three years of my life.

(It was the U.S. military that measured my IQ.)

12/28/2015 10:56:26 AM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

olderthandirt20
Over 4,000 Posts! (4,625)
Waldron, AR
69, joined Jul. 2014


Quote from ludlowlowell:
How much did I give to the tester, Duchessa asks, referring to my IQ score. I gave three years of my life.

(It was the U.S. military that measured my IQ.)



Joined at 17?

12/28/2015 3:21:04 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

duchessa
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (39,656)
Yonkers, NY
63, joined Aug. 2008


Quote from ludlowlowell:
How much did I give to the tester, Duchessa asks, referring to my IQ score. I gave three years of my life.

(It was the U.S. military that measured my IQ.)


As you were already told...go to a real tester.

12/29/2015 5:30:42 AM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

aphrodisianus
Over 1,000 Posts (1,600)
Leander, TX
66, joined Oct. 2013


Quote from ludlowlowell:
How much did I give to the tester, Duchessa asks, referring to my IQ score. I gave three years of my life.

(It was the U.S. military that measured my IQ.)


Section 8? Well, it's chapter 5 now.



[Edited 12/29/2015 5:32:15 AM ]

1/1/2016 3:19:16 AM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

sail_dancer
Over 7,500 Posts!! (8,520)
Saint Petersburg, FL
68, joined Apr. 2010


.
Quote from ludlowlowell:
I never saw George Washington, Julius Caesar, William the Conqueror, Cleopatra, or Tecumseh either, but I believe they lived and that historical reports about them are at least mostly true. So why is believing in Jesus Christ unreasonable?


You asked me this question ..... and cordially I responded to it.

Excerpt from my reply:

Quote from sail_dancer:
I would show the rest but the post would exceed limits.

I suggest you do google searches for each of the other names (use names only).

Leave Jesus for last.

Guess what ..... every one of the names have a similar biography except Jesus ..... he is the only one that does not have a biography ..... I wonder why?

I guess you have to have important info like birth and death dates ..... and no one could provide that information about Jesus.

Lets face it ..... there is not enough concrete historic information about Jesus to even write a biography on him ..... only myths exist about a storybook character named Jesus.


Why haven't you shown me equal courtesy with a response?

My complete post responding to your question is on page 9 of this thread.

Peace

1/1/2016 9:30:21 AM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

aphrodisianus
Over 1,000 Posts (1,600)
Leander, TX
66, joined Oct. 2013


It's seems Lud should be able to provide dates and times when Jesus was born. Didn't they keep birth certificates?

I wonder who they put as the father. The tale says Mary was visited by a bird who made her pregnant. How come Jesus didn't have feathers?

1/1/2016 5:39:11 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

ludlowlowell
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Sorry, I don't know the date and time of Jesus' birth. And as far as I know, they did not have birth certificates in those days. As Will Rogers once said, "Who needs birth certificates? The very fact that the kids are here proves that they were born, right?"

1/1/2016 5:54:32 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

sail_dancer
Over 7,500 Posts!! (8,520)
Saint Petersburg, FL
68, joined Apr. 2010


Quote from ludlowlowell:
Sorry, I don't know the date and time of Jesus' birth. And as far as I know, they did not have birth certificates in those days. As Will Rogers once said, "Who needs birth certificates? The very fact that the kids are here proves that they were born, right?"


You still didn't answer my post!

Did you at least google all the names you provided?

Why would Jesus be the only one that Google failed to present a biography?

Why are you evading it?

Peace

1/4/2016 7:50:09 AM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

ludlowlowell
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I've read four biographies of Jesus.

1/4/2016 8:00:50 AM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

sail_dancer
Over 7,500 Posts!! (8,520)
Saint Petersburg, FL
68, joined Apr. 2010


Quote from ludlowlowell:
I've read four biographies of Jesus.


Then why haven't you provided them for review?

And you still have not responded to my question ..... Why would Jesus be the only one that Google failed to present a biography?

Peace

1/4/2016 8:12:43 AM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  
clarence2
Over 1,000 Posts (1,554)
South Yorkshire
United Kingdom
58, joined May. 2011


.
Quote from ludlowlowell:
I've read four biographies of Jesus.

The Gospels aren't biographies in the modern sense, but are more like a kind of evangelical propaganda. I'd advise reading some modern NT scholarship to assess the question of what material in the Gospels is likely to be historical. Suggested reading ought to include Jesus: Apocalyptic Prophet of the New Millennium by Bart Ehrman, and Jesus the Jew by Geza Vermes, to name but two.



[Edited 1/4/2016 8:13:23 AM ]

1/4/2016 12:32:46 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

ludlowlowell
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The four gospels are indeed biographies, in the modern sense or any other sense.

A lot of people don't like what they say, so they reject them...

1/4/2016 2:37:38 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

sail_dancer
Over 7,500 Posts!! (8,520)
Saint Petersburg, FL
68, joined Apr. 2010


Quote from ludlowlowell:
The four gospels are indeed biographies, in the modern sense or any other sense.

A lot of people don't like what they say, so they reject them...


Bullshit! ..... the best that can be said is that the gospels are biblical stories.

Peace

1/4/2016 2:44:37 PM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  
clarence2
Over 1,000 Posts (1,554)
South Yorkshire
United Kingdom
58, joined May. 2011


.
Quote from ludlowlowell:
The four gospels are indeed biographies, in the modern sense or any other sense.

This page might whet your appetite for literature to stimulate your critical faculties. It features several NT scholars.

Extract:

Paula Fredriksen:

William Goodwin Aurelio Professor of the Appreciation of Scripture, Boston University

"RELIGIOUS ADVERTISEMENTS"

The gospels are very peculiar types of literature. They're not biographies. I mean, there are all sorts of details about Jesus that they're simply not interested in giving us. They are a kind of religious advertisement. What they do is proclaim their individual author's interpretation of the Christian message through the device of using Jesus of Nazareth as a spokesperson for the evangelist's position. The evangelist is not an author of fiction. The evangelist has traditions that go back through the Greek to the spoken language of Jesus, which was probably Aramaic. In other words, I think there's some kind of continuity between what Jesus would have been saying to other Jews in 27 to 30 and what the Evangelists in Greek are saying to their own communities, that Jesus said. But, as historians, we have to sift, and go through and try to figure out what corresponds mostly to the period of the composition in Greek and what corresponds to the lifetime of the historical Jesus.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/religion/story/gospels.html

1/5/2016 12:28:18 AM Is catholicism making a major mistake?  

ludlowlowell
Over 10,000 Posts!!! (25,981)
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If Paula Fredericksen can convince herself that the gospels are not biographies, but merely fictional stories, then she doesn't have to live the gospel, does she?