Are you in the race?

6/7/2017 11:52:25 AM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	I say: The Bible contains much truth and wisdom and is a great collection of ancient writings compiled by the Church into a book and called the Holy Bible, the "Word of God" but this is hardly true. The Bible contains many inconsistencies, contradictions, foul language, myths, legends, traditions, dogma and rampant murder for absurd reasons attributed to God's instruction and therefore cannot possibly be God's word. Was it righteous and just for the Jewish Priests (Pharisees) to kill/murder people for rather absurd non-violent reasons? Did not Jesus preach and demonstrate that the true character of God is that of a loving heavenly father of truth, beauty, goodness, compassion, understanding and righteousness -- and not that of a angry God filled with wrath and vengeance who orders men to kill (murder) people? If you believe in and follow the teachings of Jesus you must of necessity disregard all OT writings that are incompatible with his teachings. Progressive moral standards come about by progressive spiritual enlightenment and this enlightenment can come directly to the individual by prayerful communion with God and such communion and enlightenment is not dependent on either church affiliation or dictates. After Pentecost, the Spirit of Truth, the Spirit of the Son, was poured out upon all the world and not just to organized religious leaders who to this very day still falsely profess the bible (in its entirety regardless of the teachings of Jesus) to be God's inerrant word which only they are learned enough to correctly interpret. No wonder more and more people are turning away from the church and its false teachings in confusion and mistrust. They are bringing their own (divided) house down. Church leaders call man to servitude of the church on a ritual like basis and collects their ties and offerings. Christ calls man to loving service to your fellowman. Jesus tells us how we can have eternal life. And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tested him, saying, “Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?” Jesus said to him, “What is written in the law? how do you read it?” And he answered saying, “Thou shall love God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbor as thyself.” And Jesus said to him, “Thou has answered right: this do, and thou shall live.” (Luke 10:25-28) Do this and you will have eternal life the Son of God says! Love God, and love your neighbor. Could it be any clearer or simpler than that? Jesus was a revelation of God to mankind and He lived and taught a life of love and service to one's fellowman and bid his followers to do likewise. The "Good News" or "Gospel" of Jesus that He went about preaching from town to town was the simple but profound truth of the fatherhood of God and the associate truth of the brotherhood of man. Jesus taught the recognition of "Sonship" as the divine way to God consciousness and this progressive faith-realization of Sonship is not dependent on any organized religious authority. It is instead wholly a matter of personal communion with the Spirit of Truth, the Spirit of the Son, which Jesus poured out upon all the world after Pentecost and it is available to everyone. Our Heavenly Father - A God of perfect love, personality, righteousness and holiness who upholds and rules the entire vast universe of His making calls all creatures (capable of making such a decision) to...PERFECTION. Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect. Matthew 5:48 (KJV) This call to "perfection" is the Supreme Commandment of our Heavenly Father to all created intelligent beings and the keys to the kingdom are sincerity, sincerity and more sincerity; all men have these keys and that is how the race is run. Are you in the race? There are 613 Commandments attributed to God in the OT with many commanding the killing (murder) of men, women and children for all sorts of absurd reasons. "Follow me" said Jesus to his followers, believe as he believed and thereby become more like him. Why would any professed follower not want to do this? I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. [John 14:6 KJV] And, so it is man's faith-realization of SONSHIP with God is the way, the truth, and the life and Jesus revealed and demonstrated it divinely. God/Jesus does not make murderers of men for any reason let alone all the many absurd reasons in the OT and, if you can't come to this realization you will remain to the end of your days confused, morally confused and spiritually stagnate. continued page 2 Meet singles at DateHookup.dating, we're 100% free! Join now!
6/7/2017 11:53:10 AM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	Page 2 A God of "perfect love" needs no blood sacrifice and He does not invade the mind of man (including the Pharisees) to have them horribly murder (crucify) ANYONE let alone His Son Jesus who came into this world to live the life of a creature of his making, lift mankind out of spiritual darkness, and proclaim the profound "Good News" of the "Fatherhood of God" and the associate truth of the "Son-ship" and brotherhood of man. Jesus revealed God becoming man and man becoming God. We are all part of the family of God and our Heavenly Father desires that we love and serve one another and I tell you with all sincerity that it is an affront to the divine nature of God to believe, hold and teach that our Heavenly Father of perfect love and personality makes murderers of men, even killing his own Son to satisfy a blood thirst. The atonement doctrine of Paul is a false doctrine. All scripture was not inspired by God and the Bible is certainly not in its entirety the inerrant word of God. Murder is a sin and God doesn't order man to sin. Jesus was horribly tortured and crucified because His teachings were rejected by the scribes, priests and Pharisees, the self-righteous of the Jewish theocratic society, who held to their tradition and beliefs and put him to death. When Jesus said to Peter... Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven. And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. Matthew 16:17-18 KJV The "rock" Jesus spoke about was not and is not a organizational rock but rather the "rock" is the establishment of "divine contact" which Peter evidenced which is why Jesus chose him. And this "spiritual contact" is purely a personal (not an organizational) reality/experience. And it is available to everyone who seeks it irrespective of church affiliation. The claim that salvation is not available outside of the Catholic church (or any other church) and that the church is the foundation of truth in the world is FALSE. The foundation for truth in the world, indeed, in the entire vast universe is the Holy Spirit of God that speaks within that Peter evidenced. My friends, my brothers and sisters, if you shut your mind to the Spirit of Truth by exalting a book to the status of being God's Holy Word (no matter what it says or what Jesus taught) you shut yourself off from spiritual advancement. You are not listening to the Holy Spirit that speaks within you for wisdom and guidance. Thus, you are spiritually stagnating yourself for you are effectively rejecting (failing to inculcate into your heart, mind and soul) the teachings of Jesus of the true loving and caring nature of God that He so divinely revealed AND even more you are teaching (advocating) your brethren to believe and do the same. No wonder the world is in such a sad, crime ridden, ungodly and dangerous state. No wonder many shall fall short. Let he who has ears hear.
6/7/2017 1:55:29 PM	Are you in the race?
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 64, joined Feb. 2008	The first part of what you say is quite right. The Bible is indeed a host of ancient writings compiled by the Church (the Catholic Church). And it does contain a lot of real and apparent inconsistencies about historical details. But one thing it never does---it never teaches error on matters of faith and morals (when properly translated and interpreted). The 73 books of the Bible that the Catholic Church recognizes are inspired of God. How do we know this? Our holy mother the Catholic Church infallibly says so.
6/7/2017 3:55:27 PM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	Quote from ludlowlowell: The first part of what you say is quite right. The Bible is indeed a host of ancient writings compiled by the Church (the Catholic Church). And it does contain a lot of real and apparent inconsistencies about historical details. But one thing it never does---it never teaches error on matters of faith and morals (when properly translated and interpreted). The 73 books of the Bible that the Catholic Church recognizes are inspired of God. How do we know this? Our holy mother the Catholic Church infallibly says so. Ludlow, whether you realize it or not or even care you and your brainwashed kind are doing the work of Satan in teaching God our holy heavenly Father is just as murderous and inhumane as man is. You didn't answer my question so I will ask it again: Did not Jesus preach and demonstrate that the true character of God is that of a loving heavenly father of truth, beauty, goodness, compassion, understanding and righteousness and not that of a angry God filled with wrath and vengeance who orders men to kill (murder) people? Your mind is sick, Ludlow, you can't think logically as you admit above the bible "does contain a lot of real and apparent inconsistencies" yet you and your Catholic church claim all 73 books are "inspired of God." Ludlow, is your mind so "sick" that you really think it is God not man who can't keep from being inconsistent and making mistakes? We have debated for years many issues, Ludlow, and its clear to me that you have every intention of going to the grave and to judgment as a blasphemer who is unwilling to change and to which I say...So be it.
6/7/2017 5:26:39 PM	Are you in the race?
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 64, joined Feb. 2008	Is the parole board murderous when it sends a remorseless criminal back to prison? And isn't that same parole board merciful when it paroles a prisoner who does have remorse? Do we consider the parole board to be inconsistent? Jesus is like a parole board, nercifully paroling repentant sinners and severely punishing the unrepentant ones.
6/7/2017 7:37:07 PM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	You admitted the bible "contain(s) a lot of real and apparent inconsistencies" not any "parole board" Ludlow. Why don't you stop with your sick satanic illogical arguments and answer my questions?
6/7/2017 10:16:43 PM	Are you in the race?
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 64, joined Feb. 2008	The next world is like a restaurant---it has a smokong section and a non-smoking section.
6/8/2017 12:29:08 PM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	Why don't you stop with your sick satanic illogical arguments and answer my questions?
6/14/2017 11:26:05 AM	Are you in the race?
freegratis Irving, TX 50, joined Dec. 2011	Quote from kb2222: I say: The Bible contains much truth and wisdom... You wrote: Jesus said to him, “What is written in the law? how do you read it?” KB, What is this written law Jesus is talking about? I'm fairly certain it is the Torah which I would hope you would know by now that the Roman Catholic Church did not compile the Torah. You are quoting the texts in which Jesus authenticates the Old Testament. Then you go on to discuss the so-called true character of God, surely it includes forgiveness? You need to forgive whatever the so-called RC church did to you in your past and get with the revealed Word of God. The gospel (good news) is also in the OT. But the promises of the Word of God aren't all sunshine and smiles. God is Holy and Just and therefore must deal with sin. Learn why they were instructed in the OT to sacrifice a lamb. Learn why blood is required. Learn why Jesus is called the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world. How can we possibly be called Perfect, when we are commanded to be Perfect and If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us? Then learn where and in whom to put your faith/trust, or you will be in the same boat as some RC folks who will discover the wages of their sin.
6/14/2017 11:34:29 AM	Are you in the race?
freegratis Irving, TX 50, joined Dec. 2011	Quote from ludlowlowell: The next world is like a restaurant---it has a smokong section and a non-smoking section. You omitted your smoking for only a while section. It would be best to quit smoking while you can still choose. While it is still "today". Time to give up that license to smoke, which the RCC teaches.
6/14/2017 12:01:00 PM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	Quote from freegratis: You wrote: Jesus said to him, “What is written in the law? how do you read it?” KB, What is this written law Jesus is talking about? I'm fairly certain it is the Torah which I would hope you would know by now that the Roman Catholic Church did not compile the Torah. You are quoting the texts in which Jesus authenticates the Old Testament. Ridiculous. That scripture quote does NOT authenticate the Old Testament. The OT as I said and you should know is full or inconsistencies and contradictions and rampant with the killing (murder) of people for all sorts of absurd reasons and if you believe that is what Jesus taught man to do you are utterly wrong. Here let me repeat that scripture quote. Jesus said to him, “What is written in the law? how do you read it?” And he answered saying, “Thou shall love God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbor as thyself.” And Jesus said to him, “Thou has answered right: this do, and thou shall live.” Use the God given brain you have apart from church doctrine about the infallibility of the Bible the church compiled and tell me how you can love "thy neighbor as thyself" while killing thy neighbor for all those absurd reasons, freegratis? Then you go on to discuss the so-called true character of God, surely it includes forgiveness? You need to forgive whatever the so-called RC church did to you in your past and get with the revealed Word of God. The gospel (good news) is also in the OT. But the promises of the Word of God aren't all sunshine and smiles. God is Holy and Just and therefore must deal with sin. Learn why they were instructed in the OT to sacrifice a lamb. Learn why blood is required. Learn why Jesus is called the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world. How can we possibly be called Perfect, when we are commanded to be Perfect and If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us? Then learn where and in whom to put your faith/trust, or you will be in the same boat as some RC folks who will discover the wages of their sin. A blood offering to appease an angry God is what primitive man believed about God, freegratis. God is a Holy Universal Creative Spirit of Love and has no need (lust) for neither the blood of man or animal. Stop believing like a pagan, freegratis. Again, Did not Jesus preach and demonstrate that the true character of God is that of a loving heavenly father of truth, beauty, goodness, compassion, understanding and righteousness -- and not that of a angry God filled with wrath and vengeance who orders men to kill (murder) people? Yes, of course the character of God includes forgiveness and you knowing this how is it you believe God/Jesus would order man to kill people for all those ridiculous reasons I have many times posted, freegratis?
6/15/2017 11:43:56 AM	Are you in the race?
freegratis Irving, TX 50, joined Dec. 2011	Quote from kb2222: Ridiculous. That scripture quote does NOT authenticate the Old Testament... Try to answer the first part: You wrote: Jesus said to him, “What is written in the law? how do you read it?” KB, What is this written law Jesus is talking about? I'm fairly certain it is the Torah which I would hope you would know by now that the Roman Catholic Church did not compile the Torah.
6/15/2017 2:43:48 PM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	Quote from freegratis: Try to answer the first part: You wrote: Jesus said to him, “What is written in the law? how do you read it?” KB, What is this written law Jesus is talking about? I'm fairly certain it is the Torah which I would hope you would know by now that the Roman Catholic Church did not compile the Torah. As you know the Bible does not say what law Jesus was specifically referring to that's why I asked you to use your God given brain to THINK apart from church claims about the infallibility (and I might add the incompleteness) of the Bible. So, why don't you do that by answering the three questions I asked you?
6/16/2017 5:20:34 PM	Are you in the race?
iam_resurrected Reno, NV 46, joined Jul. 2014	I think the bible ironically is how it was meant to be outside the add ins and myths. I think it factually shows the error of Moses with sacrificing and explained by King David in Psalms. clearly the Jews did not listen and when Christ was here He was the sacrifice to end all sacrifices. and that there are to never be another sacrifice performed. [and yet Israel], is on its fourth petition to the U.N. to rebuild their Temple [for sacrifice].
6/16/2017 7:49:37 PM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	Quote from iam_resurrected: I think the bible ironically is how it was meant to be outside the add ins and myths. I think it factually shows the error of Moses with sacrificing and explained by King David in Psalms. clearly the Jews did not listen and when Christ was here He was the sacrifice to end all sacrifices. and that there are to never be another sacrifice performed. [and yet Israel], is on its fourth petition to the U.N. to rebuild their Temple [for sacrifice]. Why do you think God, a Universal and Perfect Spirit of Love, Truth, Compassion, Understanding, Righteousness and Forgiveness would require the horrible blood sacrificial death of His Son before He would be willing to forgive man for sin? It was the self-righteous Jewish priests that rejected and killed Jesus and it is murderous blasphemy to believe and teach this was Gods will/plan/nature.
6/17/2017 10:09:20 AM	Are you in the race?
iam_resurrected Reno, NV 46, joined Jul. 2014	It was the self-righteous Jewish priests that rejected and killed Jesus and it is murderous blasphemy to believe and teach this was Gods will/plan/nature. and yet, Christ Himself foretold to his disciples before heading into Jerusalem for Passover that He would be killed by His enemies but would raise in [3] days. and then goes onto portray Christ leading the way to His own death with disciples reluctantly following behind. so, somewhere it was the [WILL] of God to die and end something. my guess it was to end the error made by Moses. scripture not in the Bible states Christ said, He came to end ALL SACRIFICES. and if we did not end them God would be displeased. so, I think there was design for the death of Christ because Him being God would not been proper for Him to live like his disciple John did. in theory, had Christ not been crucified to end sacrifices His physical body would still be present today. so it was a plan knowing the Jews. of course God knows the Jews. they rebelled and ended up as slaves multiple times. and they would kill the physical form of God. so, I am going to have to disagree that it was a plan for Yahshua to die or He would be here now physically as [oldest human alive] in 2017 since He is God!! and I do not believe God's plan included Yahshua being 2,033 today with the humans of today. [Edited 6/17/2017 10:11:47 AM ]
6/17/2017 11:23:42 AM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	iam_resurrected, just because Jesus knew of and foretold his pending death at the hands of the self-righteous and rejecting Jewish priests DOES NOT mean that God the Father is some kind of a fickle-minded, blood thirsty, righteous one day and murderous God the next who is unwilling to forgive man for sin until Jesus has suffered a horrible torturous sacrificial death. I see you did not quote and answer my question. Why is that, Iam_resurrected? How about giving me your answer. Why do you think God, a Universal and Perfect Spirit of Love, Truth, Compassion, Understanding, Righteousness and Forgiveness would require the horrible blood sacrificial death of His Son before He would be willing to forgive man for sin?
6/17/2017 12:03:14 PM	Are you in the race?
iam_resurrected Reno, NV 46, joined Jul. 2014	Why do you think God, a Universal and Perfect Spirit of Love, Truth, Compassion, Understanding, Righteousness and Forgiveness would require the horrible blood sacrificial death of His Son before He would be willing to forgive man for sin? YAH could not allow His physical form be on earth when He was teaching His [message] to be preached by others. so Christ was only supposed to be on earth for a short time. in the Garden, Christ knew his death and wept knowing he has to correct the error made by Moses. in ISAIAH written about 8 century B.C. [before Christ] he was to be Wounded and His stripes would heal us. like i stated: Christ taught how to preach His message. that only means He was here for a short time. He even said, He was here to [end all] sacrifice.
6/17/2017 12:34:19 PM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	Good GRIEF, iam_resurrected, I suggest you invest in a better education and STOP subordinating your MIND to everything written in the Bible as Gods truth just because the early murderous church Pope leaders proclaimed the Bible and even themselves to be infallible. God the Father is NOT some kind of a fickle-minded, blood thirsty, righteous one day and murderous God the next who is unwilling to forgive man for sin until Jesus has suffered a horrible torturous sacrificial death. Would you kill your son to appease your anger or atone for the sin of your neighbor before you would forgive your neighbor?
6/17/2017 9:26:04 PM	Are you in the race?
iam_resurrected Reno, NV 46, joined Jul. 2014	it's not a point of killing your flesh. what if the Jews accepted Him at 100% value. how would Christ exit the earth? old age? He only preached for 3 1/2 years and called His own death. so, YAH knew the Jews would kill Him and how they would kill him before sending Him. so, why send Him knowing what would happen? He allowed it to happen. if YAH was against Yahshua being butchered then why did He send Him and allow it to happen [SINCE] he BEING GOD KNEW IT WAS GOING TO HAPPEN? your stance makes no sense. you act like God had no clue this was going to happen. like he sends Yahshua and then is shocked when Yahshua gets crucified. stop being silly and be sensible like you possess some form of common sense here. [Edited 6/17/2017 9:27:09 PM ]
6/18/2017 10:04:40 AM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	Quote from iam_resurrected: it's not a point of killing your flesh. what if the Jews accepted Him at 100% value. how would Christ exit the earth? old age? He only preached for 3 1/2 years and called His own death. How is it you apparently don't know the flesh (mortals) die from old age? so, YAH knew the Jews would kill Him and how they would kill him before sending Him. so, why send Him knowing what would happen? He allowed it to happen. Yes, God allowed it to happen because God does not interfere in mans freewill. Jesus plainly said.."To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice." John 18:37 Why do you reject what Jesus said and believe what Paul taught? if YAH was against Yahshua being butchered then why did He send Him and allow it to happen [SINCE] he BEING GOD KNEW IT WAS GOING TO HAPPEN? God does not interfere in mans freewill. What loving Father would not be against his Son being rejected and butchered? To claim the crucifixion of Jesus was Gods murderous plan to atone for the sin of man is blasphemy. Murdering people is a sin and its absurd to believe God wanted man to sin by murdering Jesus to save man from sin. your stance makes no sense. you act like God had no clue this was going to happen. like he sends Yahshua and then is shocked when Yahshua gets crucified. stop being silly and be sensible like you possess some form of common sense here. Again, STOP subordinating your MIND to everything written in the Bible as Gods truth just because the early murderous church Pope leaders proclaimed the Bible and even themselves to be infallible. God the Father is NOT some kind of a fickle-minded, blood thirsty, righteous one day and murderous God the next who is unwilling to forgive man for sin until Jesus has suffered a horrible torturous sacrificial death. Would you kill your son to appease your anger or atone for the sin of your neighbor before you would forgive your neighbor?
6/18/2017 10:41:55 AM	Are you in the race?
iam_resurrected Reno, NV 46, joined Jul. 2014	Quote from kb2222: How is it you apparently don't know the flesh (mortals) die from old age? of course i do and my example would had been why would not God be envisioned as dying for us [upon] the cross vs as an old man? the significance is much different because YAH knew the will of man before becoming Yahshua and knew man would kill Him!! Yes, God allowed it to happen because God does not interfere in mans freewill. Jesus plainly said.."To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice." John 18:37 Why do you reject what Jesus said and believe what Paul taught? it does not matter if God interferes...it matters in this point that God pre knowing knew the will of man when He chose to make His appearance unto His creation. you do not know the will of mankind and then put yourself without knowing you will be slaughtered unless it was your [YAH's} WILL for it to happen. if He knew how it was going to happen, and being God then allowed it to happen, it then was also the WILL of GOD for it to happen since He knew the outcome before it began!! God does not interfere in mans freewill. What loving Father would not be against his Son being rejected and butchered? To claim the crucifixion of Jesus was Gods murderous plan to atone for the sin of man is blasphemy. Murdering people is a sin and its absurd to believe God wanted man to sin by murdering Jesus to save man from sin. such a run in circle answer. horrible because God knew the "will" of man before placing Himself there. He knew the outcome before He allowed it to ever begin. if He did not like the outcome He could have made it differently. but the FACT God pre knew before becoming [flesh] the will of man meant it was also the Will of God. and as the Will of God, it ended the error by Moses, mentioned by David. Again, STOP subordinating your MIND to everything written in the Bible as Gods truth just because the early murderous church Pope leaders proclaimed the Bible and even themselves to be infallible. God the Father is NOT some kind of a fickle-minded, blood thirsty, righteous one day and murderous God the next who is unwilling to forgive man for sin until Jesus has suffered a horrible torturous sacrificial death. Would you kill your son to appease your anger or atone for the sin of your neighbor before you would forgive your neighbor? Again, when a God knows everything BEFORE it ever happens, it is the WILL of GOD for it to happen!! if not, it would had not happened since He being God already knows the outcome before it ever begins!!
6/18/2017 11:07:24 AM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	Quote from iam_resurrected: Again, when a God knows everything BEFORE it ever happens, it is the WILL of GOD for it to happen!! if not, it would had not happened since He being God already knows the outcome before it ever begins!! The fact that in God we live, move and have our being does not mean that everything we do is the "WILL of GOD." God may know the end from the beginning but that doesn't mean everything that happens is God will. A fragment of God resides within every normal minded human being and if that human by the exercise of their God given freewill decides to know and abide in Gods will then that person shall partake of life ever lasting in the eternal journey towards oneness with Almighty God the Father, the First Source and Center of all things and beings in all His glorious infinite perfection. To claim the crucifixion of Jesus was Gods murderous plan to atone for the sin of man is blasphemy. Murdering people is a sin and its absurd to believe God wanted man to sin by murdering Jesus to save man from sin.
6/18/2017 2:00:12 PM	Are you in the race?
iam_resurrected Reno, NV 46, joined Jul. 2014	Quote from kb2222: The fact that in God we live, move and have our being does not mean that everything we do is the "WILL of GOD." God may know the end from the beginning but that doesn't mean everything that happens is God will. A fragment of God resides within every normal minded human being and if that human by the exercise of their God given freewill decides to know and abide in Gods will then that person shall partake of life ever lasting in the eternal journey towards oneness with Almighty God the Father, the First Source and Center of all things and beings in all His glorious infinite perfection. To claim the crucifixion of Jesus was Gods murderous plan to atone for the sin of man is blasphemy. Murdering people is a sin and its absurd to believe God wanted man to sin by murdering Jesus to save man from sin. Still, if YAH did not desire for Christ to be crucified then why send Christ when as God you know you are going to be sacrificed. And Christ is YAH, but in flesh. So He was not murdering His Son but correcting the error of Moses Himself since no one is qualified but God to fix and correct mankind's mistakes. So He chose knowing the Jews would deny and crucify Him. He did state He was here to end all sacrifice.
6/18/2017 2:57:15 PM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	This is why Jesus came into the world and what He taught. 193:0.3 (2052.3) “And now you should give ear to my words lest you again make the mistake of hearing my teaching with the mind while in your hearts you fail to comprehend the meaning. From the beginning of my sojourn as one of you, I taught you that my one purpose was to reveal my Father in heaven to his children on earth. I have lived the God-revealing bestowal that you might experience the God-knowing career. I have revealed God as your Father in heaven; I have revealed you as the sons of God on earth. It is a fact that God loves you, his sons. By faith in my word this fact becomes an eternal and living truth in your hearts. When, by living faith, you become divinely God-conscious, you are then born of the spirit as children of light and life, even the eternal life wherewith you shall ascend the universe of universes and attain the experience of finding God the Father on Paradise. 193:0.4 (2052.4) “I admonish you ever to remember that your mission among men is to proclaim the gospel of the kingdom — the reality of the fatherhood of God and the truth of the sonship of man. Proclaim the whole truth of the good news, not just a part of the saving gospel. Your message is not changed by my resurrection experience. Sonship with God, by faith, is still the saving truth of the gospel of the kingdom. You are to go forth preaching the love of God and the service of man. That which the world needs most to know is: Men are the sons of God, and through faith they can actually realize, and daily experience, this ennobling truth. My bestowal should help all men to know that they are the children of God, but such knowledge will not suffice if they fail personally to faith-grasp the saving truth that they are the living spirit sons of the eternal Father. The gospel of the kingdom is concerned with the love of the Father and the service of his children on earth. -TUB ~~~~~~~~~~~ Again, to claim the crucifixion of Jesus was Gods murderous plan to atone for the sin of man is blasphemy. Murdering people is a sin and its absurd to believe God wanted man to sin by murdering Jesus to save man from sin.
6/18/2017 9:48:02 PM	Are you in the race?
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 64, joined Feb. 2008	Some trust in their own righteousness. Others trust in the shed Blood of Jesus Christ.
6/19/2017 10:45:12 AM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	Quote from ludlowlowell: Some trust in their own righteousness. Others trust in the shed Blood of Jesus Christ. God the Father is NOT some kind of a fickle-minded, blood thirsty, righteous one day and murderous God the next who is unwilling to forgive man for sin until Jesus has suffered a horrible torturous sacrificial death. To claim the crucifixion of Jesus was Gods murderous plan to atone for the sin of man is blasphemy. Murdering people is a sin and its absurd to believe God wanted man to sin by murdering Jesus to save man from sin. Your mind has become warped/corrupt and blasphemous by Catholic dogma, Ludlow, and its apparent you don't care and are unwilling to change.
6/19/2017 1:14:18 PM	Are you in the race?
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 64, joined Feb. 2008	So, KB,instead of trusting in Jesus' Blood, you trust in your own righteousness?
6/19/2017 1:23:11 PM	Are you in the race?
iam_resurrected Reno, NV 46, joined Jul. 2014	Again, to claim the crucifixion of Jesus was Gods murderous plan to atone for the sin of man is blasphemy. Murdering people is a sin and its absurd to believe God wanted man to sin by murdering Jesus to save man from sin. i am saying: the Will of God, was for Himself to befall in the hands of mankind's will, which led to crucifixion. ultimately He knew He was coming to earth to be crucified and allowed it to happen. therefore, i am stating: YAH used the [will of mankind] in His message about ending sacrifices and the Christian related it to the cross (the Jew still is wanting their temple rebuilt to follow Moses and sacrifice). so ultimately, the Jews [ignored] king David about the error of Moses, and God Himself came here to say it in "Person"...all through the [WILL of MANKIND]!! [Edited 6/19/2017 1:24:28 PM ]
6/19/2017 2:01:12 PM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	Iam_resurrected, did you read my post.."This is why Jesus came into the world and what He taught."? If so, what are your thoughts? Why in the world do you keep insisting that God, our Heavenly Father needs to kill people (even His own Son) to teach man righteousness and brotherly love and/or to end blood sacrifices? Why are you so blind as to how illogical and murderous that is?
6/19/2017 2:11:49 PM	Are you in the race?
iam_resurrected Reno, NV 46, joined Jul. 2014	Why in the world do you keep insisting that God, our Heavenly Father needs to kill people (even His own Son) to teach man righteousness and brotherly love and/or to end blood sacrifices? Why are you so blind as to how illogical and murderous that is? i am not doing such a thing. i am laying the [blame] at humanity. it was humanity [Moses] who disobeyed. it was revelation to reveal this error to humanity [David] and yet humanity continued to ignore it. it was humanity who nailed God to a cross. it all was the will of [humanity] that this all took place. God being God allowed [free will] of humanity to take place and while that happened, God taught us. one of His lessons was that we are NOT TO SACRIFICE!! you have missed my point. i am not stating it was God's Will [other than to allow the will of mankind to proceed while He was in their physical presence]. but during the [WILL of mankind] God in person taught us His message. and He personally corrected the error by [Moses], recognized by [David].
6/19/2017 2:14:45 PM	Are you in the race?
iam_resurrected Reno, NV 46, joined Jul. 2014	throughout the Old Testament you can clearly see [humanity] and its (will) in action from being free people to slaves, then the will wanted free and was given a promise land, but humanity wanted other things and back to being slaves. when Yahshua walked this earth it was from the Will of humanity because they cried out for Him and God always answered them.
6/19/2017 2:53:15 PM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	Quote from iam_resurrected: Why in the world do you keep insisting that God, our Heavenly Father needs to kill people (even His own Son) to teach man righteousness and brotherly love and/or to end blood sacrifices? Why are you so blind as to how illogical and murderous that is? i am not doing such a thing. i am laying the [blame] at humanity. it was humanity [Moses] who disobeyed. it was revelation to reveal this error to humanity [David] and yet humanity continued to ignore it. it was humanity who nailed God to a cross. it all was the will of [humanity] that this all took place. God being God allowed [free will] of humanity to take place and while that happened, God taught us. one of His lessons was that we are NOT TO SACRIFICE!! you have missed my point. i am not stating it was God's Will [other than to allow the will of mankind to proceed while He was in their physical presence]. but during the [WILL of mankind] God in person taught us His message. and He personally corrected the error by [Moses], recognized by [David]. "you have missed my point. i am not stating it was God's Will [other than to allow the will of mankind to proceed while He was in their physical presence]." Well, I sure have missed your point but I totally agree with what you say and I'm glad we are finally in agreement. And I take it you agree that based on what you say with the Bible rampant with the murder of people for all sorts of absurd reasons attributed to Gods instruction cannot be the truth. Right?
6/19/2017 3:03:17 PM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	Quote from ludlowlowell: So, KB,instead of trusting in Jesus' Blood, you trust in your own righteousness? You are a sick corrupt man, Ludlow. Why don't you rebut the truth of my words if you can instead of evading them with your absurd remarks?
6/19/2017 3:14:41 PM	Are you in the race?
iam_resurrected Reno, NV 46, joined Jul. 2014	Well, I sure have missed your point but I totally agree with what you say and I'm glad we are finally in agreement. And I take it you agree that based on what you say with the Bible rampant with the murder of people for all sorts of absurd reasons attributed to Gods instruction cannot be the truth. Right? if Moses disobeyed and we read this by David and Christ, that means YAH did not want animal sacrifice nor mankind killing mankind. i read once that portion of the knowledge Eve received when she ate from the tree of knowledge was, "now there will be war." so it was never YAH's WILL to have any bloodshed ever!!
6/19/2017 3:28:01 PM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	Quote from iam_resurrected: Well, I sure have missed your point but I totally agree with what you say and I'm glad we are finally in agreement. And I take it you agree that based on what you say with the Bible rampant with the murder of people for all sorts of absurd reasons attributed to Gods instruction cannot be the truth. Right? if Moses disobeyed and we read this by David and Christ, that means YAH did not want animal sacrifice nor mankind killing mankind. i read once that portion of the knowledge Eve received when she ate from the tree of knowledge was, "now there will be war." so it was never YAH's WILL to have any bloodshed ever!! Why don't you improve the quality of your posts by clicking on the quote button instead of copy/paste a sentence and reducing the spacing between your response to a post? And I don't see where you answered my question so please go ahead and do so.
6/20/2017 10:45:03 AM	Are you in the race?
iam_resurrected Reno, NV 46, joined Jul. 2014	from KB And I take it you agree that based on what you say with the Bible rampant with the murder of people for all sorts of absurd reasons attributed to Gods instruction cannot be the truth. Right? i need to really go through and learn more of these battles. i do not think it was the [idea nor will] of Yah for it to happen. i am not denying the battles and murders did happen because i know from David and Christ that Moses made an error by following the Egyptian tradition of sacrifice/killing. i believe each time the Hebrew people were enslaved and while captive there was bloodshed like written in the bible. i do not believe the bloodshed [was added] to the bible but factually took place. i do believe the bloodshed that factually took place WAS NOT the [will] of YAH!! the rules and laws were created by Moses, [whom] took advantage of an ignorant people. and David pointed it out. so had Moses been in line with YAH, we would not had Hebrew sacrifice nor many battles that included the Hebrews leading them to slavery. big big big wrong and error made by Moses. No doubt outside striking the rock for water, Moses was not entering the "Promise Land." [Edited 6/20/2017 10:46:10 AM ]
6/20/2017 12:48:30 PM	Are you in the race?
freegratis Irving, TX 50, joined Dec. 2011	Quote from kb2222: As you know the Bible does not say what law Jesus was specifically referring to that's why I asked you to use your God given brain to THINK apart from church claims about the infallibility (and I might add the incompleteness) of the Bible. So, why don't you do that by answering the three questions I asked you? List all the possible laws Jesus may have been referring to. Then you can give reasons why you discard any as the ones He was talking about on that occasion. As it stands now, the law was the Torah.
6/20/2017 12:56:34 PM	Are you in the race?
freegratis Irving, TX 50, joined Dec. 2011	Quote from iam_resurrected: Why in the world do you keep insisting that God, our Heavenly Father needs to kill people (even His own Son) to teach man righteousness and brotherly love and/or to end blood sacrifices? Why are you so blind as to how illogical and murderous that is? i am not doing such a thing. i am laying the [blame] at humanity. it was humanity [Moses] who disobeyed. it was revelation to reveal this error to humanity [David] and yet humanity continued to ignore it. it was humanity who nailed God to a cross. it all was the will of [humanity] that this all took place. God being God allowed [free will] of humanity to take place and while that happened, God taught us. one of His lessons was that we are NOT TO SACRIFICE!! you have missed my point. i am not stating it was God's Will [other than to allow the will of mankind to proceed while He was in their physical presence]. but during the [WILL of mankind] God in person taught us His message. and He personally corrected the error by [Moses], recognized by [David]. It makes you wonder why God would literally spell out His salvation plan by using the names of the Patriarchs: Hebrew English God God Adam Man Seth Appointed Enosh Mortal Kenan Sorrow; Mahalalel The Blessed God Jared Shall come down Enoch Teaching Methuselah His death shall bring Lamech The Despairing Noah Rest, or comfort. The God Man (is) appointed mortal sorrow; (but) the Blessed God shall come down teaching (that) His death shall bring (the) despairing rest. The wages of sin is death, so you better start understanding that when God says, "I set before you life and death, choose life", then maybe there is a death to be concerned about.
6/20/2017 4:37:21 PM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	* Quote from iam_resurrected: from KB And I take it you agree that based on what you say with the Bible rampant with the murder of people for all sorts of absurd reasons attributed to Gods instruction cannot be the truth. Right? i need to really go through and learn more of these battles. i do not think it was the [idea nor will] of Yah for it to happen. i am not denying the battles and murders did happen because i know from David and Christ that Moses made an error by following the Egyptian tradition of sacrifice/killing. i believe each time the Hebrew people were enslaved and while captive there was bloodshed like written in the bible. i do not believe the bloodshed [was added] to the bible but factually took place. i do believe the bloodshed that factually took place WAS NOT the [will] of YAH!! the rules and laws were created by Moses, [whom] took advantage of an ignorant people. and David pointed it out. so had Moses been in line with YAH, we would not had Hebrew sacrifice nor many battles that included the Hebrews leading them to slavery. big big big wrong and error made by Moses. No doubt outside striking the rock for water, Moses was not entering the "Promise Land." Again, Why don't you improve the quality of your posts by clicking on the quote button instead of copy/paste a sentence and reducing the spacing between your response to a post? Above you say: "i do believe the bloodshed that factually took place WAS NOT the [will] of YAH!!" Previously you said: "so it was never YAH's WILL to have any bloodshed ever!! Now, then, all those battles you speak about (wherein thousands were slaughtered) aside based on what you say I take it that you do not believe God/Jesus ordered man to stone and burn people to death at the stake for any reason let alone all the following absurd reasons in the Bible. Is this right, iam_resurrected? Kill People Who Don't Listen to Priests (Deuteronomy 17:12 NLT) Kill Witches (Exodus 22:17 NAB) Kill Homosexuals (Leviticus 20:13 NAB) Kill Fortunetellers (Leviticus 20:27 NAB) Death for Hitting Dad (Exodus 21:15 NAB) Death for Cursing Parents (Proverbs 20:20 NAB, Leviticus 20:9 NLT) Death for Adultery (Leviticus 20:10 NLT) Death for Fornication (Leviticus 21:9 NAB) Death to Followers of Other Religions (Exodus 22:19 NAB) Kill Nonbelievers (2 Chronicles 15:12-13 NAB) Kill False Prophets (Zechariah 13:3 NAB) Kill the Entire Town if One Person Worships Another God (Deuteronomy 13:13-18 NLT) Kill Women Who Are Not Virgins On Their Wedding Night (Deuteronomy 22:20-21 NAB) Kill Followers of Other Religions. (Deuteronomy 13:7-12 NAB, Deuteronomy 17:2-5 NLT) Death for Blasphemy (Leviticus 24:10-16 NLT) Kill False Prophets (Deuteronomy 13:1-5 NLT, Deuteronomy 18:20-22 NLT) Infidels and Gays Should Die (Romans 1:24-32 NLT) Kill Anyone who Approaches the Tabernacle (Numbers 1:48-51 NLT) Kill People for Working on the Sabbath (Exodus 31:12-15 NLT) Kill Sons of Sinners (Isaiah 14:21 NAB)
6/20/2017 4:46:34 PM	Are you in the race?
iam_resurrected Reno, NV 46, joined Jul. 2014	Quote from freegratis: It makes you wonder why God would literally spell out His salvation plan by using the names of the Patriarchs: Hebrew English God God Adam Man Seth Appointed Enosh Mortal Kenan Sorrow; Mahalalel The Blessed God Jared Shall come down Enoch Teaching Methuselah His death shall bring Lamech The Despairing Noah Rest, or comfort. The God Man (is) appointed mortal sorrow; (but) the Blessed God shall come down teaching (that) His death shall bring (the) despairing rest. The wages of sin is death, so you better start understanding that when God says, "I set before you life and death, choose life", then maybe there is a death to be concerned about. even within the Garden was the Tree of Life. but that only means God always knew during the Garden He would die because of man's "free will." but He did not have to die for us to be saved. He said, to just believe upon and in Him and you are saved. and i truthfully feel Moses made an error since both David and Yahshua pointed it out about not sacrificing to God, but just believing in Him. So even in the Old Testament, God wanted what people finally understood from Yahshua [a personal walk with His believers not requiring sacrifice]. had peeps listened to David and ignored Moses, the Jews would have had a personal walk with God...not being a butcher of idol worship in the Holy Temple of YAH!! [Edited 6/20/2017 4:47:38 PM ]
6/20/2017 4:47:20 PM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	Quote from freegratis: List all the possible laws Jesus may have been referring to. Then you can give reasons why you discard any as the ones He was talking about on that occasion. As it stands now, the law was the Torah. You are disingenuous at best. In my post to you 6/14/2017 1:01:00 PM (Page 1) I asked you three questions so why haven't you answered them? Are you afraid to honestly answer them? It appears so. So what's the use in trying to have a sincere conversation with you if you can't bring yourself to honestly answer questions? Go bother someone else if you can't be honest, freegratis.
6/20/2017 5:55:30 PM	Are you in the race?
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 64, joined Feb. 2008	1. If Jesus' suffering and death were not necessary for our salvation, why did Jesus say to Peter "get thee behind me, Satan" when Peter said he didn't want Jesus to suffer? 2. If Jesus' suffering and death weren't necessary for our salvation, why did not Jesus hide in the desert, flee to another country, or do some other thing to keep from being arrested, tortured, and killed? Jesus was and is the Power over the universe. He could have prevented His own suffering and death.
6/20/2017 6:04:22 PM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	Quote from kb2222: Ludlow, whether you realize it or not or even care you and your brainwashed kind are doing the work of Satan in teaching God our holy heavenly Father is just as murderous and inhumane as man is. You didn't answer my question so I will ask it again: Did not Jesus preach and demonstrate that the true character of God is that of a loving heavenly father of truth, beauty, goodness, compassion, understanding and righteousness and not that of a angry God filled with wrath and vengeance who orders men to kill (murder) people? Your mind is sick, Ludlow, you can't think logically as you admit above the bible "does contain a lot of real and apparent inconsistencies" yet you and your Catholic church claim all 73 books are "inspired of God." Ludlow, is your mind so "sick" that you really think it is God not man who can't keep from being inconsistent and making mistakes? We have debated for years many issues, Ludlow, and its clear to me that you have every intention of going to the grave and to judgment as a blasphemer who is unwilling to change and to which I say...So be it.
6/20/2017 6:10:07 PM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	Quote from ludlowlowell: 1. If Jesus' suffering and death were not necessary for our salvation, why did Jesus say to Peter "get thee behind me, Satan" when Peter said he didn't want Jesus to suffer? 2. If Jesus' suffering and death weren't necessary for our salvation, why did not Jesus hide in the desert, flee to another country, or do some other thing to keep from being arrested, tortured, and killed? Jesus was and is the Power over the universe. He could have prevented His own suffering and death. Jesus wasn't afraid of death and He didn't want Satan via Peter to be trying to convince him otherwise. Answer the two questions I asked in my previous post, Ludlow.
6/21/2017 2:12:57 AM	Are you in the race?
ludlowlowell Panama City, FL 64, joined Feb. 2008	Jesus freely chose to die, and die a horrible death. He is God and could have easily (1) never died or (2) died a painless death at age 80. No, Jesus was on a mission, the mission being to atone for the world's sins by dying a horrible painful death.
6/21/2017 2:35:59 AM	Are you in the race?
followjesusonly Kingman, AZ 74, joined May. 2012	* Ludlow says: Jesus freely chose to die, and die a horrible death. He is God and could have easily (1) never died or (2) died a painless death at age 80. No, Jesus was on a mission, the mission being to atone for the world's sins by dying a horrible painful death. You are a very sick Catholic man, Lud, obsessed with the world's sins and with your own sins. In another thread (Why works are necessary for salvation) you contradict God yet again, while you try to justify your self righteousness and your sect's wrong teachings. ...Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? (Luke 10:25) "Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbor as thyself." (Luke 10:27) Nothing there about what you have added to Jesus, that "works are necessary, blah, blah." You reek of Satan contradicting God the way you do.
6/21/2017 2:43:06 AM	Are you in the race?
followjesusonly Kingman, AZ 74, joined May. 2012	Quote from ludlowlowell: So, KB,instead of trusting in Jesus' Blood, you trust in your own righteousness? Jesus never said anything about "trusting in Jesus' Blood." You are a very sick Catholic man and you reek of Satan. ...Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? (Luke 10:25) "Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbor as thyself." (Luke 10:27) Jesus says: "...when thou prayest, ...pray to thy Father." Mat 6:6 Mat 6:9 "...therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven..." But Ludlow contradicts and disputes Jesus and says: "I would recommend that people pray sometimes to Mary or one of the saints... Let the prayer life have some variety." You are a very very sick Catholic man.
6/21/2017 2:53:39 AM	Are you in the race?
followjesusonly Kingman, AZ 74, joined May. 2012	Quote from iam_resurrected: i am not doing such a thing. i am laying the [blame] at humanity. it was humanity [Moses] who disobeyed. it was revelation to reveal this error to humanity [David] and yet humanity continued to ignore it. it was humanity who nailed God to a cross. it all was the will of [humanity] that this all took place. God being God allowed [free will] of humanity to take place and while that happened, God taught us. one of His lessons was that we are NOT TO SACRIFICE!! you have missed my point. i am not stating it was God's Will [other than to allow the will of mankind to proceed while He was in their physical presence]. but during the [WILL of mankind] God in person taught us His message. and He personally corrected the error by [Moses], recognized by [David]. A lot, if not all, of the cause for the mess on this world really lies with the default of agents of God's government, namely "The Devil" who rebelled, and Adam and Eve, who defaulted on their mission to our world. Our world is the victim of the double defaults of agents of God's government. We are not actually all to blame for what has happened here. It's kinda like if you had a nursery school full of 3 and 4 year-olds and the teachers gave them a bunch of candy and matches and then went on strike and left them to their own devices, you'd have a mess.
6/21/2017 3:07:33 AM	Are you in the race?
followjesusonly Kingman, AZ 74, joined May. 2012	Quote from ludlowlowell: So, KB,instead of trusting in Jesus' Blood, you trust in your own righteousness? ================================================================================ You don't even love God enough to obey Him. Why do you call Him "Lord" and refuse to do the things He says? "Why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?" (Luke 6:46) "If a man love me, he will keep my words."(John 14:23) "He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings." (John 14:24) According to Jesus, you don't even love God. Stop calling priests, "Father" and stop praying to Mary and other dead people. "But thou, when thou prayest, ...pray to thy Father." (Matthew 6:6) You reek of Satan.
6/21/2017 1:07:10 PM	Are you in the race?
iam_resurrected Reno, NV 46, joined Jul. 2014	Quote from followjesusonly: A lot, if not all, of the cause for the mess on this world really lies with the default of agents of God's government, namely "The Devil" who rebelled, and Adam and Eve, who defaulted on their mission to our world. Our world is the victim of the double defaults of agents of God's government. We are not actually all to blame for what has happened here. It's kinda like if you had a nursery school full of 3 and 4 year-olds and the teachers gave them a bunch of candy and matches and then went on strike and left them to their own devices, you'd have a mess.
6/21/2017 2:23:17 PM	Are you in the race?
freegratis Irving, TX 50, joined Dec. 2011	Quote from kb2222: You are disingenuous at best. In my post to you 6/14/2017 1:01:00 PM (Page 1) I asked you three questions so why haven't you answered them? Are you afraid to honestly answer them? It appears so. So what's the use in trying to have a sincere conversation with you if you can't bring yourself to honestly answer questions? Go bother someone else if you can't be honest, freegratis. Dear Mr Disingenuous, You have a funny (strange) way of counting when you owe someone an answer or when they owe you an answer. I'd hate to get into a clan war with you over who killed whom first/last; like the Hatfields and McCoys. Go ahead and keep deluding yourself. There are simple verses about blood and death and atonement; And there are sentences only possible to be penned by God (like the meaning of the names of the Patriarchs). So now it seems you cannot even come up with 1 written law Jesus could possibly have been referring to when He asked, "How do you read it?" Maybe he meant the written law of comedy and damnation yet to be written -- aka The Urantia Book? Why did He not mean the Torah, Mr Disingenuous?
6/21/2017 2:31:23 PM	Are you in the race?
freegratis Irving, TX 50, joined Dec. 2011	Quote from kb2222: Jesus wasn't afraid of death and He didn't want Satan via Peter to be trying to convince him otherwise. Answer the two questions I asked in my previous post, Ludlow. Jesus didn't want Peter to convince him otherwise of what? Of what Ludlow said -- to go to His death to be our sacrificial Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world. I'll just start answering my own questions to you since you are too disingenuous. You'll just be responsible for what you know. Now you know.
6/21/2017 5:56:54 PM	Are you in the race?
followjesusonly Kingman, AZ 74, joined May. 2012	freegratis said: Jesus didn't want Peter to convince him otherwise of what? Of what Ludlow said -- to go to His death... blah blah? You should stop there. Jesus didn' want Peter to convince Him not to go to His death. Yes, that's right. The rest that you added is the doctrines of men. You can read the verse as well as anyone. Mat 16:22 Then Peter took him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee. None of your doctrines of men about, "our sacrificial Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world" are there.
6/22/2017 12:52:01 PM	Are you in the race?
kb2222 Jacksonville, FL 76, joined Apr. 2011	* Quote from kb2222: * Quote from iam_resurrected: from KB And I take it you agree that based on what you say with the Bible rampant with the murder of people for all sorts of absurd reasons attributed to Gods instruction cannot be the truth. Right? i need to really go through and learn more of these battles. i do not think it was the [idea nor will] of Yah for it to happen. i am not denying the battles and murders did happen because i know from David and Christ that Moses made an error by following the Egyptian tradition of sacrifice/killing. i believe each time the Hebrew people were enslaved and while captive there was bloodshed like written in the bible. i do not believe the bloodshed [was added] to the bible but factually took place. i do believe the bloodshed that factually took place WAS NOT the [will] of YAH!! the rules and laws were created by Moses, [whom] took advantage of an ignorant people. and David pointed it out. so had Moses been in line with YAH, we would not had Hebrew sacrifice nor many battles that included the Hebrews leading them to slavery. big big big wrong and error made by Moses. No doubt outside striking the rock for water, Moses was not entering the "Promise Land." Again, Why don't you improve the quality of your posts by clicking on the quote button instead of copy/paste a sentence and reducing the spacing between your response to a post? Above you say: "i do believe the bloodshed that factually took place WAS NOT the [will] of YAH!!" Previously you said: "so it was never YAH's WILL to have any bloodshed ever!! Now, then, all those battles you speak about (wherein thousands were slaughtered) aside based on what you say I take it that you do not believe God/Jesus ordered man to stone and burn people to death at the stake for any reason let alone all the following absurd reasons in the Bible. Is this right, iam_resurrected? Kill People Who Don't Listen to Priests (Deuteronomy 17:12 NLT) Kill Witches (Exodus 22:17 NAB) Kill Homosexuals (Leviticus 20:13 NAB) Kill Fortunetellers (Leviticus 20:27 NAB) Death for Hitting Dad (Exodus 21:15 NAB) Death for Cursing Parents (Proverbs 20:20 NAB, Leviticus 20:9 NLT) Death for Adultery (Leviticus 20:10 NLT) Death for Fornication (Leviticus 21:9 NAB) Death to Followers of Other Religions (Exodus 22:19 NAB) Kill Nonbelievers (2 Chronicles 15:12-13 NAB) Kill False Prophets (Zechariah 13:3 NAB) Kill the Entire Town if One Person Worships Another God (Deuteronomy 13:13-18 NLT) Kill Women Who Are Not Virgins On Their Wedding Night (Deuteronomy 22:20-21 NAB) Kill Followers of Other Religions. (Deuteronomy 13:7-12 NAB, Deuteronomy 17:2-5 NLT) Death for Blasphemy (Leviticus 24:10-16 NLT) Kill False Prophets (Deuteronomy 13:1-5 NLT, Deuteronomy 18:20-22 NLT) Infidels and Gays Should Die (Romans 1:24-32 NLT) Kill Anyone who Approaches the Tabernacle (Numbers 1:48-51 NLT) Kill People for Working on the Sabbath (Exodus 31:12-15 NLT) Kill Sons of Sinners (Isaiah 14:21 NAB) Waiting for your answer to my question "Is this right, iam_resurrected?

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