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1/8/2017 10:32:20 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

fyathyrio
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Quote from kb2222:
Perhaps these quotes from the UB will give you food for thought.

:5.2 God is much more than a personality as personality is understood by the human mind; he is even far more than any possible concept of a superpersonality. But it is utterly futile to discuss such incomprehensible concepts of divine personality with the minds of material creatures whose maximum concept of the reality of being consists in the idea and ideal of personality. The material creature’s highest possible concept of the Universal Creator is embraced within the spiritual ideals of the exalted idea of divine personality. Therefore, although you may know that God must be much more than the human conception of personality, you equally well know that the Universal Father cannot possibly be anything less than an eternal, infinite, true, good, and beautiful personality.

1:5.10 The idea of the personality of the Universal Father is an enlarged and truer concept of God which has come to mankind chiefly through revelation. Reason, wisdom, and religious experience all infer and imply the personality of God, but they do not altogether validate it. Even the indwelling Thought Adjuster is prepersonal. The truth and maturity of any religion is directly proportional to its concept of the infinite personality of God and to its grasp of the absolute unity of Deity. The idea of a personal Deity becomes, then, the measure of religious maturity after religion has first formulated the concept of the unity of God.

1:5.11 Primitive religion had many personal gods, and they were fashioned in the image of man. Revelation affirms the validity of the personality concept of God which is merely possible in the scientific postulate of a First Cause and is only provisionally suggested in the philosophic idea of Universal Unity. Only by personality approach can any person begin to comprehend the unity of God. To deny the personality of the First Source and Center leaves one only the choice of two philosophic dilemmas: materialism or pantheism.

1:5.12 In the contemplation of Deity, the concept of personality must be divested of the idea of corporeality. A material body is not indispensable to personality in either man or God. The corporeality error is shown in both extremes of human philosophy. In materialism, since man loses his body at death, he ceases to exist as a personality; in pantheism, since God has no body, he is not, therefore, a person. The superhuman type of progressing personality functions in a union of mind and spirit.

1:5.13 Personality is not simply an attribute of God; it rather stands for the totality of the co-ordinated infinite nature and the unified divine will which is exhibited in eternity and universality of perfect expression. Personality, in the supreme sense, is the revelation of God to the universe of universes.




Nope! sounds like the author is using big words to give the impression that something deep and meaningful is being read. It is doubletalk.

I think most people would translate that as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>BS

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1/8/2017 11:10:04 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

kb2222
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Quote from fyathyrio:
Nope! sounds like the author is using big words to give the impression that something deep and meaningful is being read. It is doubletalk.

I think most people would translate that as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>BS

It appears your problem is the lack of a better education. What "doubletalk" do you see?

1/8/2017 11:11:22 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

asanb
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Quote from fyathyrio:
Why is it that a person insists that God is something other than energy or consciousness?

The answer is.....

because they have been told otherwise by somebody they trust would not mislead them.

because they were raised from childhood to believe otherwise and never decided to question it.

because they lack critical thinking skills that would allow them to see their misapprehension.

because it undermines his book, and if any part of it should apear indefensable, it might lead to DOUBT

1/8/2017 11:55:01 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

kb2222
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Asanb, what sort of spiritual growth do you think possible for you since you believe God is not a personality? I mean if God is not a personality and personality does not survive physical death to what end is your spiritual growth as you see it?

1/8/2017 9:18:56 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

asanb
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Quote from kb2222:
Asanb, what sort of spiritual growth do you think possible for you since you believe God is not a personality? I mean if God is not a personality and personality does not survive physical death to what end is your spiritual growth as you see it?


God may or may not be a "personality". Frankly Omniscient and omnipotent all inclusive entities may choose to be whatever they want. We are a drop of that consciousness and the more we come into contact with it the more we become like it and less like our mortal selves of ignoble aspirations. Human beings have many layers of husks. This body dies, but the soul remains still dyed by it's experiences and karma of this plane. That stain is gradually erased as we ascend into pure consciousness in a purely spiritual realm.

That Is part of the journey, but it's irrelevant.
deciding to trust in the promise of salvation after death is a failure at inception.
It's like bathing by not getting in the tub because we know the concept of cleanliness.
It's a denial of the laws of nature. Only living things grow and reproduce and develop relationships. Why is it that spiritual development should be any different? Dead people do not become Jesus disciples because they "believed in Jesus" while they lived.
You must make you bed in the beyond while you are living this life, or you fail to make the leap. Knowing scripture, Heaps of books, and lot's of rules will not help you, because most of the intellect dissolves at death.
When you die, you are what you are at that moment: desires , attachments, proclivities, Virtues and vices and most of all loving or unloving. Whatever you are attached to is where you go. You make you next life in this one.
Those who wait for salvation at that moment take with them whatever they have built for themselves.

1/8/2017 9:22:39 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

asanb
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Quote from kb2222:
Asanb, what sort of spiritual growth do you think possible for you since you believe God is not a personality? I mean if God is not a personality and personality does not survive physical death to what end is your spiritual growth as you see it?


Who are we to decide God's qualities?

1/8/2017 9:42:58 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

fyathyrio
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Religion does not answer questions. It teaches you not to question.

1/8/2017 10:42:04 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

followjesusonly
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Quote from fyathyrio:
Religion does not answer questions. It teaches you not to question.


Not my religion doesn't.

1/9/2017 9:34:27 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

kb2222
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Quote from asanb:
Who are we to decide God's qualities?

That's such a dumb evasive response to my question(s). Do you not decide what is good and what is evil? Do you not to decide to love rather than hate?

This body dies, but the soul remains still dyed by it's experiences and karma of this plane. That stain is gradually erased as we ascend into pure consciousness in a purely spiritual realm.

Is it your belief that when you "ascend into pure consciousness in a purely spiritual realm" you cease to be a personality?



[Edited 1/9/2017 9:35:11 AM ]

1/9/2017 12:59:56 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

asanb
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So I was told.

1/9/2017 1:15:03 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

kb2222
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Most people have been told a lot of things and I didn't ask you what you have been told.
I asked you what you believe. Why do you have such a hard time honestly responding to questions, asanb? Do you not value sincerity?

1/9/2017 2:44:42 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

followjesusonly
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Asanb said:
This body dies, but the soul remains still dyed by it's experiences and karma of this plane. That stain is gradually erased as we ascend into pure consciousness in a purely spiritual realm.

THE SEVENTH MANSION WORLD
47:9.1 Any discernible differences between those mortals hailing from the isolated and retarded worlds and those survivors from the more advanced and enlightened spheres are virtually obliterated during the sojourn on the seventh mansion world. Here you will be purged of all the remnants of unfortunate heredity, unwholesome environment, and unspiritual planetary tendencies. The last remnants of the “mark of the beast” are here eradicated. -The Urantia Book

Asanb could be closer to some truth than he knows. His expression that "the soul remains still dyed by it's experiences and karma of this plane. That stain is gradually erased," is perhaps closely related to "The last remnants of the “mark of the beast” are here eradicated."

1/9/2017 5:54:06 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

asanb
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Quote from kb2222:
Most people have been told a lot of things and I didn't ask you what you have been told.
I asked you what you believe. Why do you have such a hard time honestly responding to questions, asanb? Do you not value sincerity?


I have written comments and statements directly about the topics at hand. Yor refusal to accept another point of view , labeling my answers "evasive" is simply an avoidance of the topic.
You can't defend "god must be a personality", so you keeep blathering that I'm not giving you the correct answers in order to avoid the logical on topic discussion that reasonable people have.

I wrote what I thought about God being a personality, Didn't I(see Above}. Now a grown up would respond with " I disagree with what you wrote because......"

Not this crap

1/9/2017 6:41:20 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

kb2222
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Quote from asanb:
I have written comments and statements directly about the topics at hand. Yor refusal to accept another point of view , labeling my answers "evasive" is simply an avoidance of the topic.
You can't defend "god must be a personality", so you keeep blathering that I'm not giving you the correct answers in order to avoid the logical on topic discussion that reasonable people have.

I wrote what I thought about God being a personality, Didn't I(see Above}. Now a grown up would respond with " I disagree with what you wrote because......"

Not this crap

I haven't refused to "accept another point of view" asanb. I have asked you two questions which apparently you can't bring yourself to answer. And I'm not "blathering" that you haven't given me the "correct answer." You haven't given an answer.

Seriously, asanb, if God is not a personality and personality does not survive physical death to what end is your spiritual growth as you see it?

If God is not a personality to "what" will your loyalty and devotion be directed to?

1/9/2017 7:41:50 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

fyathyrio
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Quote from kb2222:
It appears your problem is the lack of a better education. What "doubletalk" do you see?




The whole premise that God is a personality begins with the statement that humans cant really understand what the author is trying to express.

Basically, your book says this is the truth about God, but really you are not capable of getting it.


It is BS and no amount of insults directed at me will change that


:5.2 God is much more than a personality as personality is understood by the human mind; he is even far more than any possible concept of a superpersonality. But it is utterly futile to discuss such incomprehensible concepts of divine personality with the minds of material creatures whose maximum concept of the reality of being consists in the idea and ideal of personality.


BS



[Edited 1/9/2017 7:43:50 PM ]

1/9/2017 8:01:07 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

fyathyrio
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:5.2 God is much more than a personality as personality is understood by the human mind; he is even far more than any possible concept of a superpersonality. But it is utterly futile to discuss such incomprehensible concepts of divine personality with the minds of material creatures whose maximum concept of the reality of being consists in the idea and ideal of personality.

Lets investigate whether my maximum concept of the reality of being consists in the idea and ideal of personality.

I am a living soul with a physical body. Spirit/God/energy is my essence. I am not separate from the universe. In fact, it is me and I am it. The same goes for everybody. You might also say that I am an electro-spiritual energy field existing in a field of energy and information. You might also say that I am an aperture through which the universe becomes aware of itself. You might also say I am a point of consciousness within the mind of God.


Personality????????????

1/9/2017 9:45:42 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

followjesusonly
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Quote from fyathyrio:
The whole premise that God is a personality begins with the statement that humans cant really understand what the author is trying to express.

Basically, your book says this is the truth about God, but really you are not capable of getting it.


Basically, it says it's "utterly futile to discuss such incomprehensible concepts of divine personality."

You can no more understand the personality of an Infinite Being than you can understand Infinity or Eternity. These concepts are "utterly incomprehensible" to a finite mind.

The term "personality" is used differently in The Urantia Book from how we generally use it. The way we use it, different dogs and different cats and even parakeets and cottontails each have their own personality. We have cottontails here and we feed them, and of about a dozen, two, and only two, will take carrots from my hand. We say they have different personalities. Some will eat at the bowl and some will grab a piece of carrot and run off a few feet to eat it. They're all different, for sure, but is that really personality? Does it offend you that The Urantia Book says you are incapable of understanding the infinite? Humble yourself.



1/9/2017 10:05:47 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

asanb
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The "end" of all spiritual growth is union with one's creator. It's what all religions and most of humanity is and has always been about. We are gregarious in nature because our essence is built of the same as every other conscious creature. like attracts like. God was one and wished to become many, so creation occurred. We are one of many, and yearn to return to our original form.

Religion is the social form. Spirituality is the personal journey.

Hint: It's bigger on the inside.

1/9/2017 10:43:11 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

fyathyrio
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Quote from followjesusonly:
Basically, it says it's "utterly futile to discuss such incomprehensible concepts of divine personality."

You can no more understand the personality of an Infinite Being than you can understand Infinity or Eternity. These concepts are "utterly incomprehensible" to a finite mind.

The term "personality" is used differently in The Urantia Book from how we generally use it. The way we use it, different dogs and different cats and even parakeets and cottontails each have their own personality. We have cottontails here and we feed them, and of about a dozen, two, and only two, will take carrots from my hand. We say they have different personalities. Some will eat at the bowl and some will grab a piece of carrot and run off a few feet to eat it. They're all different, for sure, but is that really personality? Does it offend you that The Urantia Book says you are incapable of understanding the infinite? Humble yourself.

So why don't you tell me why you think God is something other than what is.....

I disagree with the Urantia book when it describes God the way it does.

I am generally offended by religion because I feel it does more harm than good

1/10/2017 1:24:50 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

followjesusonly
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Quote from fyathyrio:


So why don't you tell me why you think God is something other than what is.....


It's hard to say. I was raised on the idea of God as a Creator. It's a second nature idea to me now. It's just how I think of God, as a Creator, as a Divine Father, as a friendly PERSON, albeit a spiritual person. I feel that I love God and that He loves me, and The Urantia Book says (I think, if I can find it), and I agree, that people can only love other people. (Some say they "love" their new car, etc. No, they just like it.) I don't see how I could feel love for a mechanistic machine of a universe and have a mechanistic universe love me back.

I disagree with the Urantia book when it describes God the way it does.


That's fine. I can't argue with honest disagreement on such things. It may have to do on what we were raised on. You know, a lot of Christians, when they were 3, 4 years old, were given line drawings of a man, Jonah, sitting inside a whale or fish. They BELIEVE that story, and they have no idea why they believe it, but they believe it because they were told it was true when they were 4 years old and told to color inside the lines of their line drawing with their crayons. And so it's implanted in them, deep down, and they believe it and they don't give it a second thought.

I am generally offended by religion because I feel it does more harm than good


A lot of religion does that, but I don't see that The Urantia Book fits that. It's just a book. There are no churches or priests, etc. It's just, read the book and whatever YOU make of it is whatever you make of it.

Bigd the other day said we expect them (others, Christians I guess) to accept The Urantia Book as "scripture." We expect no such thing. We'd only like people to read it and decide for themselves.

1/10/2017 10:10:44 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

kb2222
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Quote from followjesusonly:
I feel that I love God and that He loves me, and The Urantia Book says (I think, if I can find it), and I agree, that people can only love other people.

1:7.3 The concept of truth might possibly be entertained apart from personality, the concept of beauty may exist without personality, but the concept of divine goodness is understandable only in relation to personality. Only a person can love and be loved. Even beauty and truth would be divorced from survival hope if they were not attributes of a personal God, a loving Father.

1/10/2017 10:17:57 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

kb2222
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Quote from asanb:
The "end" of all spiritual growth is union with one's creator.

I agree, absolutely true. God IS personality and personality is the "unifier" of mind and spirit.

1/10/2017 12:17:47 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

followjesusonly
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Quote from kb2222:
1:7.3 The concept of truth might possibly be entertained apart from personality, the concept of beauty may exist without personality, but the concept of divine goodness is understandable only in relation to personality. Only a person can love and be loved. Even beauty and truth would be divorced from survival hope if they were not attributes of a personal God, a loving Father.


Thank you. I couldn't find the quote.

1/10/2017 8:18:02 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

asanb
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Quote from kb2222:
I agree, absolutely true. God IS personality and personality is the "unifier" of mind and spirit.



WTF does that mean?

1/10/2017 8:22:41 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  
cupocheer
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1/10/2017 8:44:00 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

fyathyrio
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Quote from asanb:
WTF does that mean?



It doesn't mean anything
Nobody can explain it
It makes no sense at all

Disregard it for it is complete BS

1/11/2017 11:06:42 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

kb2222
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Quote from asanb:
WTF does that mean?

Quote from fyathyrio:
It doesn't mean anything
Nobody can explain it
It makes no sense at all

Disregard it for it is complete BS

WIF do you not understand?

1/11/2017 10:42:17 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

fyathyrio
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Quote from kb2222:
I agree, absolutely true. God IS personality and personality is the "unifier" of mind and spirit.




Kb......the above statement is what I don't understand because to me "personality" has nothing to do with God. God is not a person.

We can say God is life, energy, consciousness, spirit, love, light.

I am a living soul

Soul is comprised of spirit/God, mind, and body in my view.

To say personali8ty is the unifier of mind and spirit is odd to me because in my view God is spirit/energy.

The word spirit means energy or enthusiasm.

the greek root of the word enthusiasm means "God within" or "inspired by God"

I don't see what personality has to do with it

1/11/2017 10:43:33 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  
cupocheer
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Personality has zilch to do with God.

1/12/2017 6:59:24 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

indianadave1951
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The creation can't create the creator.

The famous Last Supper painting in Milan Italy was the creation: Leonardo da Vinci was the creator. It's inconceivable how the painting could create the artist.

de Vinci was so much above the artwork he created just as God is so much above the universe he created.



1/12/2017 7:09:15 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

indianadave1951
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Quote from cupocheer:
Personality has zilch to do with God.


Not quite sure I agree. Jesus said "If you have seen me you have seen the Father". Jesus had a personality and emotions and was/is the express image of God the father. Scripture mentions that God has likes, dislikes, love , etc.

John 3:16-
"For God so Loved the world ..."




[Edited 1/12/2017 7:09:57 AM ]

1/12/2017 8:54:40 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

kb2222
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Quote from fyathyrio:
Kb......the above statement is what I don't understand because to me "personality" has nothing to do with God. God is not a person.

We can say God is life, energy, consciousness, spirit, love, light.

I am a living soul

Soul is comprised of spirit/God, mind, and body in my view.

To say personali8ty is the unifier of mind and spirit is odd to me because in my view God is spirit/energy.

The word spirit means energy or enthusiasm.

the greek root of the word enthusiasm means "God within" or "inspired by God"

I don't see what personality has to do with it

Well, fyathyrio, God is not a person as you understand personhood but that doesn't mean that God cannot be a "spirit personality" and if you can say "God is life, energy, consciousness, spirit, love, light" that "inspires" man yet God is not, and cannot be, a divine loving personality that man can fellowship with I wish you would explain this to me?

Here, let me give you some more food for thought.


1:5.13 Personality is not simply an attribute of God; it rather stands for the totality of the co-ordinated infinite nature and the unified divine will which is exhibited in eternity and universality of perfect expression. Personality, in the supreme sense, is the revelation of God to the universe of universes.

1:3.6 (25.6) In the universes God the Father is, in potential, the overcontroller of matter, mind, and spirit. Only by means of his far-flung personality circuit does God deal directly with the personalities of his vast creation of will creatures, but he is contactable (outside of Paradise) only in the presences of his fragmented entities, the will of God abroad in the universes. This Paradise spirit that indwells the minds of the mortals of time and there fosters the evolution of the immortal soul of the surviving creature is of the nature and divinity of the Universal Father. But the minds of such evolutionary creatures originate in the local universes and must gain divine perfection by achieving those experiential transformations of spiritual attainment which are the inevitable result of a creature’s choosing to do the will of the Father in heaven.

1:3.7 (26.1) In the inner experience of man, mind is joined to matter. Such material-linked minds cannot survive mortal death. The technique of survival is embraced in those adjustments of the human will and those transformations in the mortal mind whereby such a God-conscious intellect gradually becomes spirit taught and eventually spirit led. This evolution of the human mind from matter association to spirit union results in the transmutation of the potentially spirit phases of the mortal mind into the morontia realities of the immortal soul. Mortal mind subservient to matter is destined to become increasingly material and consequently to suffer eventual personality extinction; mind yielded to spirit is destined to become increasingly spiritual and ultimately to achieve oneness with the surviving and guiding divine spirit and in this way to attain survival and eternity of personality existence.

1:7.1 (31.1) When Jesus talked about “the living God,” he referred to a personal Deity — the Father in heaven. The concept of the personality of Deity facilitates fellowship; it favors intelligent worship; it promotes refreshing trustfulness. Interactions can be had between nonpersonal things, but not fellowship. The fellowship relation of father and son, as between God and man, cannot be enjoyed unless both are persons. Only personalities can commune with each other, albeit this personal communion may be greatly facilitated by the presence of just such an impersonal entity as the Thought Adjuster.

1:7.2 (31.2) Man does not achieve union with God as a drop of water might find unity with the ocean. Man attains divine union by progressive reciprocal spiritual communion, by personality intercourse with the personal God, by increasingly attaining the divine nature through wholehearted and intelligent conformity to the divine will. Such a sublime relationship can exist only between personalities.

1:7.3 (31.3) The concept of truth might possibly be entertained apart from personality, the concept of beauty may exist without personality, but the concept of divine goodness is understandable only in relation to personality. Only a person can love and be loved. Even beauty and truth would be divorced from survival hope if they were not attributes of a personal God, a loving Father.

1:6.8 (30.7) God is spirit — spirit personality; man is also a spirit — potential spirit personality. Jesus of Nazareth attained the full realization of this potential of spirit personality in human experience; therefore his life of achieving the Father’s will becomes man’s most real and ideal revelation of the personality of God. Even though the personality of the Universal Father can be grasped only in actual religious experience, in Jesus’ earth life we are inspired by the perfect demonstration of such a realization and revelation of the personality of God in a truly human experience.

1/12/2017 9:03:27 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  
cupocheer
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Dave, God (as the human embodiment of humankind) in Jesus Christ did possess a "personality" and a charismatic magnatism. That is a given.

Jesus did say "if you have seen me, you have seen the Father".

Please Note the use of the word "IF" in Jesus' comment.

Now allow me to extrapolate -- Have you (or anyone) "seen" the physical, tangible, body of the human man of God that was presented as Jesus Christ, the human, since His ascension

Not to get 'too deep', here is a consideration in having stated the previous --

WHY -- IF -- GOD had a need to rely on "personality" as a factor didn't God present in His own image instead of re-creating Himself into a bone and flesh human in order for bone and flesh human to comprehend Him and follow Him?

Sir, "personality", as with mannerisms, facial expressions, etc are "learned" response, not a birthright. Observe any 'born blind' human and you will comprehend what I am alluding to.

God IS NOT dependent upon personality.

1/12/2017 9:42:34 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

kb2222
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Quote from cupocheer:
God IS NOT dependent upon personality.

Personality is not simply an attribute of God; it rather stands for the totality of the co-ordinated infinite nature and the unified divine will which is exhibited in eternity and universality of perfect expression. Personality, in the supreme sense, is the revelation of God to the universe of universes.

Continued in my post above.

1/12/2017 6:54:29 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

asanb
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"totality of the co-ordinated infinite nature and the unified divine will"

What does that mean?

"exhibited in eternity and universality of perfect expression"

What does that mean?

"Personality, in the supreme sense, is the revelation of God to the universe of universes."

What does that mean?

1/12/2017 8:23:47 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

kb2222
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Quote from asanb:
"totality of the co-ordinated infinite nature and the unified divine will"

What does that mean?

Really? It means what it says? What don't you understand?

"exhibited in eternity and universality of perfect expression"

What does that mean?

It means what it says. What don't you understand?

"Personality, in the supreme sense, is the revelation of God to the universe of universes."

What does that mean?

It means what it says. What don't you understand?

1/12/2017 8:39:07 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

fyathyrio
Over 2,000 Posts (2,648)
Savannah, GA
48, joined Nov. 2009


Quote from asanb:
"totality of the co-ordinated infinite nature and the unified divine will"

What does that mean?

"exhibited in eternity and universality of perfect expression"

What does that mean?

"Personality, in the supreme sense, is the revelation of God to the universe of universes."

What does that mean?



It is gibberish and when kbb asks "what don't you understand?" he is simply avoiding your question because he does not know what it means.

In conjunction with forthright attitude the primary resource dictates that forevermore theological imperatives must retain thematic order. See how easy it is to BS.

1/12/2017 9:07:23 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

kb2222
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Quote from fyathyrio:
It is gibberish and when kbb asks "what don't you understand?" he is simply avoiding your question because he does not know what it means.

In conjunction with forthright attitude the primary resource dictates that forevermore theological imperatives must retain thematic order. See how easy it is to BS.

Did you read all of my post or just the first paragraph? And why didn't you answer my question, fyathyrio?

1/13/2017 7:48:23 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

fyathyrio
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Quote from indianadave1951:
The creation can't create the creator.

The famous Last Supper painting in Milan Italy was the creation: Leonardo da Vinci was the creator. It's inconceivable how the painting could create the artist.

de Vinci was so much above the artwork he created just as God is so much above the universe he created.



How did the artist get created ?

Back to the question....

If you can believe in an eternal God that created the universe then why not just believe in an eternal universe understood as God?

1/13/2017 8:03:41 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

fyathyrio
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Quote from kb2222:
Did you read all of my post or just the first paragraph? And why didn't you answer my question, fyathyrio?



The only question you asked me was "What don't you understand?"

I thought it was understood that the gibberish you posted from Urantia did not make sense to me.

I didn't understand it, but not because of a lack of education.

Even you cant tells us what it means.

You are the one not answering the question sir.

1/13/2017 9:16:33 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

kb2222
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Quote from fyathyrio:
How did the artist get created ?

Back to the question....

If you can believe in an eternal God that created the universe then why not just believe in an eternal universe understood as God?

Why do you keep repeating this question when I since the second post on this thread answered it and several times repeated it and apparently you can't refute what I said?

Only a "personality" can place "value" on words/concepts/meanings. The physical universe is wholly unconcerned with love, truth, goodness and righteousness.

1/13/2017 9:25:13 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

rufftreasure
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Fairmont, MN
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Trying to force others to believe and think the way you do will be the downfall of our incoming president too.
Communication break down, and actual revolt tends to be the end product of tyrannical dictators.

1/13/2017 9:37:22 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

kb2222
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Quote from fyathyrio:
The only question you asked me was "What don't you understand?"

You are not very astute are you? Can't keep up, can you? Are you blind? I asked you in my post to you 1/12/2017 9:54:40 AM the following question:

Well, fyathyrio, God is not a person as you understand personhood but that doesn't mean that God cannot be a "spirit personality" and if you can say..."God is life, energy, consciousness, spirit, love, light"...that "inspires" man yet God is not, and cannot be, a divine loving personality that man can fellowship with I wish you would explain this to me?

So go ahead and explain, fyathyrio.

I thought it was understood that the gibberish you posted from Urantia did not make sense to me.

Yes, I understand that you have a comprehension problem but I asked you..."Did you read all of my post or just the first paragraph?" So did you or didn't you?

I didn't understand it, but not because of a lack of education.

That apparently is not true.

Even you cant tells us what it means.

It means what it says. If you don't know what words mean don't you know how to use a dictionary?

You are the one not answering the question sir.

I asked for clarification of what you don't understand in the phrases quoted and neither you or asanb responded. Again, if you don't know what words mean don't you know how to use a dictionary?

1/13/2017 9:49:55 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

kb2222
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Quote from rufftreasure:
Trying to force others to believe and think the way you do will be the downfall of our incoming president too.
Communication break down, and actual revolt tends to be the end product of tyrannical dictators.

We are having a discussion and I am not "forcing" anyone to do anything and Trump hasn't even taken office yet so we will see what we will see. However, I do think the world is heading for a nuclear war in large part because organized Christianity has failed to proclaim to the world the "Good News", the "Gospel of the Kingdom", that Jesus taught and instructed His followers to proclaim.



[Edited 1/13/2017 9:50:46 AM ]

1/13/2017 10:05:46 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

ludlowlowell
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KB, do you honestly think that world peace can be had if it's based on the kind of Nazi eugenics you believe in?

1/13/2017 10:07:21 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

rufftreasure
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That wasn't specifically for you, generally speaking, it's an observation of dynamics.

I'm glad we have a place to have discussions.

1/13/2017 10:07:54 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

rufftreasure
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Quote from ludlowlowell:
KB, do you honestly think that world peace can be had if it's based on the kind of Nazi eugenics you believe in?


Ohhhhhhhhh that's rich Hahahahahahahaha

1/13/2017 10:20:34 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

kb2222
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Quote from ludlowlowell:
KB, do you honestly think that world peace can be had if it's based on the kind of Nazi eugenics you believe in?

Why do you ignore the importance of what I said and spew out this Nazi nonsense? You are a pathetically corrupt man, Ludlow.

1/13/2017 10:49:33 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

fyathyrio
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Quote from kb2222:
We are having a discussion and I am not "forcing" anyone to do anything and Trump hasn't even taken office yet so we will see what we will see. However, I do think the world is heading for a nuclear war in large part because organized Christianity has failed to proclaim to the world the "Good News", the "Gospel of the Kingdom", that Jesus taught and instructed His followers to proclaim.



ok...in the above statement you have said something I agree with. Christianity does not deliver.

Now that we share an opinion lets move from there.

Universality......means the quality of involving or being shared by all people

Would you agree that spirituality is the umbrella under which all religions fall?

Can we agree that God is spirit?

I understand we are talking about the same thing, but differently. Would you agree?

I think the difference we are having is that I tend to think of God as an impersonal force that works according to certain principles whereas you tend to think of God as a personality.


For me, God is the matrix we are all in....if you will



[Edited 1/13/2017 10:51:46 AM ]

1/13/2017 11:14:36 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

kb2222
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Quote from fyathyrio:
ok...in the above statement you have said something I agree with. Christianity does not deliver.

Now that we share an opinion lets move from there.

Universality......means the quality of involving or being shared by all people

Would you agree that spirituality is the umbrella under which all religions fall?

Can we agree that God is spirit?

I understand we are talking about the same thing, but differently. Would you agree?

I think the difference we are having is that I tend to think of God as an impersonal force that works according to certain principles whereas you tend to think of God as a personality.


For me, God is the matrix we are all in....if you will

Are you going to respond to my previous posts?

Yes, I certainly agree God is Spirit. A universal, eternal and infinite loving and caring spirit in which we live, move and have our being.

I think the difference we are having is that I tend to think of God as an impersonal force that works according to certain principles whereas you tend to think of God as a personality.

Yes, that appears to be the case so why don't you respond to what I have said and repeated several times? to wit...

"Only a "personality" can place "value" on words/concepts/meanings. The physical universe is wholly unconcerned with love, truth, goodness and righteousness."

Do you agree or disagree, fyathyrio?

1/13/2017 11:53:27 AM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

nonstandard
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Quote from kb2222:
It means what it says. What don't you understand?


Everything on earth has a mind of its own , thats how everything is designed .

The lie is to actually believe that you stand alone , above everything else .

1/13/2017 12:50:09 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

kb2222
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Jacksonville, FL
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Everything is designed to have a consciousness relative to its form and substance and God is the designer who offers eternal life to those who seek Him.

1/13/2017 3:19:28 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

asanb
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Quote from asanb:
"totality of the co-ordinated infinite nature and the unified divine will"

What does that mean?

"exhibited in eternity and universality of perfect expression"

What does that mean?

"Personality, in the supreme sense, is the revelation of God to the universe of universes."

What does that mean?


What's a co-ordinated infinite nature?

Wouldn't divine will always be coherent and cohesive? why add an adjective?

what does eternity and expression have to do with each other? please explain.

What does Personality have to do with Revelation?

There is only one "universe" it is all inclusive by definition. How can there be a "universe of universes"?

1/13/2017 3:20:39 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

asanb
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Why won't you answer my question, KB?

1/13/2017 3:23:55 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

asanb
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Quote from kb2222:
Everything is designed to have a consciousness relative to its form and substance and God is the designer who offers eternal life to those who seek Him.


Is that an idea from the Urantia Book expressed in simple , plan language?

Thank God You understand it, I can't.

Verbosity is not clarity.

1/13/2017 3:38:11 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

followjesusonly
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Quote from kb2222:
Why do you ignore the importance of what I said and spew out this Nazi nonsense? You are a pathetically corrupt man, Ludlow.


*
Ludlow is a very sick Catholic man, ensnared in a very sick, monstrous cult, the Catholic church.

Jesus says:
"If ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: (Mat 6:14)

But Ludlow contradicts Jesus the Son of God and says:
"God does NOT forgive everyone who forgives others."

Jesus says: "But thou, when thou prayest ...pray to thy Father." Mat 6:6

But Ludlow/Satan contradict Jesus the Son of God and says: "I would recommend that people pray sometimes to Mary or one of the saints... Let the prayer life have some variety."

Jesus says: "Call no man your father upon the earth: "for one is your Father, which is in heaven." (Matthew 23:9)

But Ludlow and the Satanic Catholic church he belongs to refuse to obey Jesus, calling all their priests, "Father" and even going so blasphemously far as calling their head man "The Holy Father," a term Jesus uses for God in Heaven.

Pro_16:25 There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.

1/13/2017 4:01:02 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

fyathyrio
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Savannah, GA
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Quote from kb2222:
Yes, that appears to be the case so why don't you respond to what I have said and repeated several times? to wit...

"Only a "personality" can place "value" on words/concepts/meanings. The physical universe is wholly unconcerned with love, truth, goodness and righteousness."

Do you agree or disagree, fyathyrio?




I understand that WE place value in words/concepts, that WE give life meaning.

To say the physical universe is wholly unconcerned with love, truth, goodness, and righteousness is a stretch in my view because we still do not fully understand the nature of consciousness.

To separate consciousness from the physical universe seems a stretch as well because consciousness may be the fundamental foundation from which the universe arises.

1/13/2017 4:10:39 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

fyathyrio
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Savannah, GA
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Please understand exactly what I am saying.....


God is what is.

Why do you think God is something else?


"and I have no religion
and I don't know what's what
and I don't know the limit, the limit of what we've got."

BONO U2

1/13/2017 5:28:57 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

followjesusonly
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Kingman, AZ
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Quote from fyathyrio:
Please understand exactly what I am saying.....

God is what is.


So you say.

Why do you think God is something else?


Why do you think God isn't something else? Why do you think God is not a Creator, or THE Creator?

You, like everyone else, just believe what you want to believe.

1/13/2017 6:28:46 PM The question Christians refuse to discuss. | Page 3  

fyathyrio
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Quote from followjesusonly:
Why do you think God isn't something else? Why do you think God is not a Creator, or THE Creator?

You, like everyone else, just believe what you want to believe.



The reason is because when you call God the creator there is an implied sense of separation. The creator stands apart from the creation.
As a result, the question arises............"who is God?"

I don't feel God is a "who" thing.

I feel God is a "what" thing

I feel that primitive humans personified the universe and constructed a personal God

Anthropomorphism is ascribing human qualities to nonhuman things.

I feel that is how we came to the false sense that God is a separate creator.

It is an intellectual error or a misapprehension in my opinion.